Is the water live?

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4 years 1 month ago #349213 by Gisteron
Replied by Gisteron on topic Is the water live?
It sounds like what you are saying, Erinis, is that spirituality can happily be rooted in bad reasoning or in none at all. By no means am I one to stand up and defend the idea of spirituality in general, but still I think we can do better than say that fallacious arguments are par for the course in it. That something had to create us is not felt or intuitive, unless one is brought up to feel and intuit it. And if an argument form ignorance (i.e. "just because you can't disprove it doesn't mean its nonsense" type of stuff) is what it takes to maintain a form of spirituality, then, to my ears, that's more of a condemnation of that form of spirituality, than it is of the intellect that dares abstain from it.

Better to leave questions unanswered than answers unquestioned
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4 years 1 month ago #349222 by Ambert The Traveller
Water makes up a significant fraction of the human body, both by weight and by volume. By weight, the average human adult male is approximately 60% water, and the average adult female is approximately 55% water. The body water constitutes as much as 93% of the body weight of a newborn infant.

Most of animal body water is contained in various body fluids. These include intracellular fluid; extracellular fluid; plasma; interstitial fluid; and transcellular fluid. Water is also contained inside organs, in gastrointestinal, cerebrospinal, peritoneal, and ocular fluids.

(All the above from Wikipedia)

Allright, let's try some logic:

Would you say, you are alive? And does this include your body? Is your body alive? Wouldn't this being alive of your body then have to include the water that is a significant part of it?

Or let's assume the contrary and say water is dead. A baby would then be 93 % dead. Males 60% dead, females 55 % dead. Hm, probably the bones, too, the brain, all of it. Dead matter. No life to be found anywhere, according to this kind of materialist thinking?

I am afraid it not as simple as just applying some simple logics and deductions from arbitrary definitions.

Without water, no life as we know it can survive. Water gives life to basically everything we consider alive. Astronomers look for water on planets when they are looking for life. Surely, the occurence of life and the occurence of water correlate significantly.

----

"Who are they?"
"The Guardians of the Whills. Protectors of the Temple of the Kyber. But there's nothing left to protect, so now they're just causing trouble for everybody."
―Jyn Erso and Cassian Jeron Andor
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4 years 1 month ago - 4 years 1 month ago #349223 by OB1Shinobi
Replied by OB1Shinobi on topic Is the water live?
Here is an interesting article on the topic.

https://www.nasa.gov/vision/universe/starsgalaxies/life's_working_definition.html

Warning: Spoiler!

People are complicated.
Last edit: 4 years 1 month ago by OB1Shinobi.
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4 years 1 month ago #349224 by Br. John
Replied by Br. John on topic Is the water live?
Why does that make water alive? Is sodium alive? You cannot live without it. Oxygen? Hydrogen? Can't have water without them combined as H20

Essential Elements for Life https://chem.libretexts.org/Bookshelves/General_Chemistry/Book%3A_Chemistry_(Averill_and_Eldredge)/01%3A_Introduction_to_Chemistry/1.8%3A_Essential_Elements_for_Life

Founder of The Order
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4 years 1 month ago - 4 years 1 month ago #349225 by
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Gisteron wrote:That something had to create us is not felt or intuitive, unless one is brought up to feel and intuit it. And if an argument form ignorance (i.e. "just because you can't disprove it doesn't mean its nonsense" type of stuff)

Yes sure, just because I can´t disapprove the existence of God it doesn´t mean its nonsense, but also you can´t prove it.
It´s like conspiracy theory, which has the same concept. Question is, do you believe that God exists because society said so? It´s not such long time
when everyone thoughts that the Earth is flat, also nonsense and look how everybody believed that.
I don´t say that the existence of God is impossible, I am just trying to show you that everything simply cannot be understood just by head.

When you put your hand into fire (as a child who doesn´t have knowledge about fire), the first reaction of body is transfer information
into brain though nerves which contains cells (made from water) in addition the water same as blood is conductive.
As Ambert said, your body without water, and everybody could imagine what would happened with body if this information from nerves wouldn´t
be transmitted into brain. In this case is whole logic useless.[/b]

Qui-gon Jinn " Concentrate on the moment. Feel, don´t think. Use your instincts"
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4 years 1 month ago - 4 years 1 month ago #349234 by
Replied by on topic Is the water live?

Manu wrote: Ignorance, yet Knowledge. Though I can appreciate the ineffable aspect of "the Force"



This struck me as one of the most contradictory statements ever made!. Lol jedi here love their knowledge right? But then all over the doctrine here there are soft areas that skim over this tenet and ignore the actual fact that we dont really know anything about the force or consciousness or where the universe even came from. Every religion except this jediism has clear and exact descriptions of the nature of reality, how it got here, the agencies involved and the process done to make it. But the one religion that puts knowledge highest does none of this. Instead the doctrine is a few lines defined by a single person and put up as something we are all supposed to agree to. And when we disagree on those things its said well that's ok individual belief is great and not all has to be followed. But present something, anything outside of the realm of science and look out!!! You in for the fight of your life!!. Know why? Because the actual doctrine here doesnt really tell us anything at all. It's not a basis for a religion that people can get behind at all! There is nothing there but a bit of ghost turd fluff and so we are all left to try and define these things on our own instead of relying in a clear and concise written doctrine that we can start using as a base of common discussion. Instead we all just start wherever we are and let the wars rage!
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4 years 1 month ago - 4 years 1 month ago #349235 by Adder
Replied by Adder on topic Is the water live?
Jediism doesn't prescribe a fairytale to help you sleep at night.... it invites you to build a subjective mindset to connect to objective reality given the best knowledge available at one's time. Not being like other religions is sorta the point... its better.

But back on topic, if we're just talking subjective reality and path, then yea water signifies a 'raft' of paradigms for me as the first conceptual domain in my top level training toolkit... which I see Wu Xing as representing in my take on Daoism. But water itself is just symbolic despite its associated attributes. I guess there is an argument for it to be considered sacred almost in the sense its one of the things required for survival, and as such can take special place in some embued perception of an engineered subjective reality (ie view).... but I wouldn't want to muddy that by placing expectations too much, things like that at that level need to be born of union between subconscious and consciousness, not just imagined and forced.

Knight ~ introverted extropian, mechatronic neurothealogizing, technogaian buddhist. Likes integration, visualization, elucidation and transformation.
Jou ~ Deg ~ Vlo ~ Sem ~ Mod ~ Med ~ Dis
TM: Grand Master Mark Anjuu
Last edit: 4 years 1 month ago by Adder.
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4 years 1 month ago #349236 by
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It just floors me that jedi would rather stay ignorant rather than honestly explore these things.

The force is ineffable, cant be known? That is one bold conclusion based in ignorance.

What if it's actually not? But present even the slightest possibility that we might know something about it and get a this knee jerk spinnin that "well we dont know, but its Definately not that!" Its the embracing of ignorance over knowledge.
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4 years 1 month ago #349237 by OB1Shinobi
Replied by OB1Shinobi on topic Is the water live?

Fyxe wrote: Its the embracing of ignorance over knowledge.


Didnt you once try to make a rational case in defense of belief in santa clause?

People are complicated.
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4 years 1 month ago #349238 by
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How do you know it's a fairy tale? Why would you even say that? Can you prove your claim that it's a fairy tale? Why would you even write a fairy tale about it? Why not write what is believed about it? What is true for jedi?
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