The Field, and Lynn McTaggert

I chuckled out loud!

Way to go!

Well, until Ty pointed out other fallicies in her thoughts, for all I know, her theories are the difference between scientists...

From an uneducated pov, it telex with my own feelings on a gut level...

The only real argument I heard about her (that I remember, I'm sure someone will show me I'm wrong, lol) was that her science/math/whatever, was wrong... Which is how experts in any field usually speak...:lol:...

And, I'm not sure the Council is smart enough, they still have me on it....

That's why I ask Ty for a better example, and something sort of easy... Easy for a guy with the same degrees you have (too much bar philosophy, lol) no schoolin'....

I need it really dumbed down...:lol:

Someone once told me that they could win any argument because they knew how to debate so well. Fancy words, misdirection, poking holes in statements, these are all good for winning an argument. But winning does not address the issue.

I don't think I can sit through listening to all of The Field. I am familiar with Lynne McTaggert, and while I would not go so far as to say I hate her, I have nothing but the deepest levels of contempt for that woman.

We are slow in Council. That's just how it is. And I doubt that is going to change any time soon. So to address your initial question...

Is it necessary to complete every single part of it?

The IP is for your benefit. Work what you will. But, to enter into an apprenticeship the IP is required to be completed in its entirety.

steamboat28 wrote:

Gisteron wrote: Rather than testing people for their critical thinking skills...how about introducing people to critical thinking instead?

This, exactly. If I were re-organizing the IP, I'd add in some modules on critical thinking and logic (and "God Wants You Dead" as non-optional material) before ever introducing Watts or Campbell, simply because it helps one to better understand their own worldview, and discuss it with others in a sane, rational, consistent fashion, rather than the shouting and talking-over-one-another and disagreement on glosses and meanings that usually occur anytime two people in the Temple disagree.

Ren wrote: I've been particularly opposed to the inclusion of that thing during my years on the council, but the evil witch has her supporters here. It's sad to see some of the newer knights believe that the IP content is somehow at the core of jedi teachings when it really isn't.

Love it or hate it (I choose the latter, personally), "The Field" is a very important way to close out Exercise 4 as it currently stands. It introduces some interesting points, and mistakenly hides them behind a misunderstanding of science. This combination of aspects is a very educational one, and I think it should remain, even though it's composed of 85% fecal matter.

Furthermore, I'm going to build a couchfort neighboring Gisteron's pillow fortress, because I personally think that if the IP has nothing to do with core Jedi teachings, it needs to be utterly replaced by things that are core Jedi teachings. There is no sense having an introductory course that functions as a test if it doesn't also provide foundational material necessary to the continuing of training. If the IP serves no purpose but as a grand test of who does and doesn't "belong" here, why not just pose a simple question at the gate and turn away all those who answer foolishly? If the IP teaches nothing, it is the same process, but requiring much more effort, and returning greater frustration.

I havent read this whole thread... My main issue with her is that she makes ("good") money by exploiting basic human weaknesses. the book itself is probably one of her better works, but still falls short.

Gisteron is right, and in fact, I tried to implement such changes on a new IP I was working on. But some people objected. So, the new IP just became yet another annoying project I didn't want to spare time for.

I don't know who can access it, but here are the links to what I had done so far:

http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/1951-introduction
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/1962-lesson-i
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2010-lesson-2
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2011-lesson-3
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2012-lesson-4
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2022-lesson-5
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2023-lesson-6
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2024-lesson-7
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2026-lesson-8
http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/component/content/article/51-new-ip/2028-lesson-9

Thanks Ren....

Akkarin has revitalized your call to arms on it, and is meeting the same road blocks...

Its not we are against the changes, but, how can I agree with something that I'm uniformed about? (Jiddu to name one, and I don't wantvto derail, so I will stop...... I'm just learning about him...)

The IP has gotten us this far, and we will make changes...

But, you know me, if you want an answer now, its "no"... As I am uninformed enough to make a decision to.implement a change...

Maybe Akkarin will have more patience with me, lolol...

tzb wrote: Sorry to butt in, but...

tzb wrote: how about someone write an essay on different conceptions of and explanations for the Force (a little like the essays in clerical training), giving a breakdown of the more common ideas? Off the back of this brief breakdown, you could provide links to a variety of texts (including The Field, perhaps the Tao Te Ching, perhaps a more general look at prana/qi/reiki and others) for each view, and ask Novices to write a minimum-word-counted essay on both one they feel convincing, and one they feel farthest from their personal conception of the Force.

That way you're still encouraging interaction with the idea, still asking people to look at their own credulity, but not prescribing a single specific definition for critique.

When I say "someone" to write the essay, you could ask people who hold those views at the Temple to write a few paragraphs, then put the best of those together for the lesson. That way you're representing the actual range of beliefs of the Temple, including no doubt some who hold The Field in esteem.

And just as an example of what I mean, you could ask Novices to write a minimum of 500 words on the one they like, and min 250 words on the one they don't... and of course if they feel like it they can write about all of the ideas.

[/2c]

This is the thing we need, from my perspective. An IP crafted by Jedi for Jedi, supplemented with all the things currently in the IP and the Library.

steamboat28 wrote:

tzb wrote: Sorry to butt in, but...

tzb wrote: how about someone write an essay on different conceptions of and explanations for the Force (a little like the essays in clerical training), giving a breakdown of the more common ideas? Off the back of this brief breakdown, you could provide links to a variety of texts (including The Field, perhaps the Tao Te Ching, perhaps a more general look at prana/qi/reiki and others) for each view, and ask Novices to write a minimum-word-counted essay on both one they feel convincing, and one they feel farthest from their personal conception of the Force.

That way you're still encouraging interaction with the idea, still asking people to look at their own credulity, but not prescribing a single specific definition for critique.

When I say "someone" to write the essay, you could ask people who hold those views at the Temple to write a few paragraphs, then put the best of those together for the lesson. That way you're representing the actual range of beliefs of the Temple, including no doubt some who hold The Field in esteem.

And just as an example of what I mean, you could ask Novices to write a minimum of 500 words on the one they like, and min 250 words on the one they don't... and of course if they feel like it they can write about all of the ideas.

[/2c]

This is the thing we need, from my perspective. An IP crafted by Jedi for Jedi, supplemented with all the things currently in the IP and the Library.

It is buddy...

Where do you think the IP came from?

Or, do you mean what we discussed a few posts back?

steamboat28 wrote: This is the thing we need, from my perspective. An IP crafted by Jedi for Jedi, supplemented with all the things currently in the IP and the Library.

I don't know if this is exactly what you mean but...

The IP and indeed all of our learning should be crafted by the best and most relevant material we can find to teach what we want. We shouldn't do it because the material is made by a Jedi, it being made by a Jedi should always be coincidental.

Indeed using it just because it's made by a Jedi is a form of discrimination.

Jestor wrote: It is buddy...

Where do you think the IP came from?

Or, do you mean what we discussed a few posts back?

Akkarin wrote: I don't know if this is exactly what you mean but...

The IP and indeed all of our learning should be crafted by the best and most relevant material we can find to teach what we want. We shouldn't do it because the material is made by a Jedi, it being made by a Jedi should always be coincidental.

Indeed using it just because it's made by a Jedi is a form of discrimination.

What I mean to say is that I think that, given the unique interpretations of the material currently presented, the Temple should "write its own textbooks" for core subjects, and use the material found in the current IP and the library as "required additional reading material" for the purpose of helping offset the [strike]bullshit [/strike] wisdom and transcendent understanding that will undoubtedly be spewed by some of us in the core material.