The Field, and Lynn McTaggert

Ty wrote: It isn't stated that it isn't dogma -anywhere-, so how are you supposed to know that?

Another question is why assume it is dogma? Again, no wrong way, but it shows the Master's how an individual thinks and that makes it easier to connect likeminded people and/or develop a better Apprenticeship experience later down the track.

The exercises are under a TAB called studies so I was lead to believe I was studying Jedi Doctrine in hopes of becoming a Jedi Knight. If it's just a test we should change the name of the TAB to test instead of studies.

I know I said it wasn't a test. It's a journal of ones path, the study is the self, the Force... the contents is the authors expression of who they are and how they choose to move forward to become a Knight.

Vesha wrote: The exercises are under a TAB called studies so I was lead to believe I was studying Jedi Doctrine in hopes of becoming a Jedi Knight. If it's just a test we should change the name of the TAB to test instead of studies.

Semantics.

"Test", I think was inaccurate, but generally not exactly inaccurate. In this sense, I don't feel it meant test as in "how you score, and if you get it right", but instead as in "to test the waters" - to see what they are all about, how they are working, what kind of engine they're running on...

You get it?

TOTJO is not looking for someone to exclusively disagree, nor agree. I think TOTJO is looking for someone who, regardless of whether or not they resonate with it, that they are thinking critically for themselves as to why - that seems to be the point of it.

Proteus wrote: I don't feel it meant test as in "how you score, and if you get it right", but instead as in "to test the waters" - to see what they are all about, how they are working, what kind of engine they're running on...

You get it?

TOTJO is not looking for someone to exclusively disagree, nor agree. I think TOTJO is looking for someone who, regardless of whether or not they resonate with it, that they are thinking critically for themselves as to why - that seems to be the point of it.

This is another one of my major gripes with the IP's current incarnation. Only after I get frustrated and ask for help do people say "How you interpret the question is more important than your answers." Especially if the training masters are interested in our critical thinking skills, when the IP never mentions or teaches those (outside of possibly "God Wants You Dead", which isn't required reading.) If they'd said that in the beginning, I might've had half an inkling of what to do.

steamboat28 wrote:

Proteus wrote: I don't feel it meant test as in "how you score, and if you get it right", but instead as in "to test the waters" - to see what they are all about, how they are working, what kind of engine they're running on...

You get it?

TOTJO is not looking for someone to exclusively disagree, nor agree. I think TOTJO is looking for someone who, regardless of whether or not they resonate with it, that they are thinking critically for themselves as to why - that seems to be the point of it.

This is another one of my major gripes with the IP's current incarnation. Only after I get frustrated and ask for help do people say "How you interpret the question is more important than your answers." Especially if the training masters are interested in our critical thinking skills, when the IP never mentions or teaches those (outside of possibly "God Wants You Dead", which isn't required reading.) If they'd said that in the beginning, I might've had half an inkling of what to do.

There was a good bit of being lost for me as well during the first half of the time I was going through the IP - I felt I was being presented with material to come up with answers to something... but I didn't really know what the question even was! lol!

Later I figured out what question(s) (for myself) the material most clearly seemed to help me answer:

Why Jedi? Why The Force? Under what pretenses and justified perception would a Jedi come believe in such a thing? And what does that mean about who I am and how I live my life?

Adder wrote:

Ty wrote: It isn't stated that it isn't dogma -anywhere-, so how are you supposed to know that?

Another question is why assume it is dogma? Again, no wrong way, but it shows the Master's how an individual thinks and that makes it easier to connect likeminded people and/or develop a better Apprenticeship experience later down the track.

Well, first and foremost, because this is not just a fan forum or the like. It's an official religion. And if a religion says "bone up on this information" it should generally be assumed to be doctrine or something they wholeheartedly endorse.

If it isn't something TotJO endorses, it shouldn't be in the curriculum. The curriculum should have things that will help -everyone- along their path, and the current setup does not do that. It was 50/50 whether I posted this or just left, because to be completely honest, the way things are structured doesn't make half a lick of sense to someone trying to find a genuine path, and not be randomly deflected by things that have no bearing on what they are trying to learn. The studies are nice in general, though I don't think they are very evenly paced, and currently, they encourage people to be so open minded their brains fall out. Lynn McTaggert's very existence in the curriculum as something to take seriously, rather than simply to ponder, goes against the Jedi doctrine. If it is something to ponder, that should be clear.

I admit I have zero experience with any organized Jedi religion outside of this site, but the doctrine is something I've followed all my life, for the most part, without really thinking of codifying it.
The doctrine page is awesome, and nicely illustrates everything, but the rest of the path to becoming a Jedi in the order is so mysteriously confounding as to make any of the SW Old Republic Jedi Masters proud.


I know I'm new, and I'm not trying to offend anyone or get under anyone's skin. But if I feel this way, how many other people are turned from the doors because of it? How many people read the doctrine, get excited, and then realize that it's an insane amount of work to begin to be a part of this... and not all of it is even relevant?

I don't know if it is ToTJO's hope to recruit people, or grow steadily, but it would be far easier if there were a unified curriculum that helped teach critical thinking, the physics behind what a real world force would/does look like, and -then- go into all the metaphysical and philosophical possibilities.

The IP serves a function to represent areas, not content. Perhaps it's an unusual paradigm, but it made sense to me because each persons path is different, they arrive with different areas of interest, and different levels of prior understanding, and they grow into further unique Jedi. Some people might like McTaggert for example, and even perhaps support her position on vaccine's but we are not in the business of telling people what to believe is right or wrong.... the area is quantum mechanics and the general public's interest in it... what is yours? The Apprenticeship is where the more personal focus is meant to knuckle down onto those issues you discuss, and the IP is the sounding board for that process to be orientated against.

But isn't it part of the duty of a Jedi to find out the truth, when possible, and act as mediator? To resolve conflict?

If someone is clearly in the wrong, and some people just cannot see it, isn't it the path of the Jedi to work with that?

McTaggert is clearly wrong, and her stances on health and vaccines cause measurable harm. That is not an opinion, that is medical fact, supported by mountains of evidence.

Shouldn't it be a Jedi's calling to be open to such a conclusion, to gain knowledge?

Wisdom is in the application of knowledge, so then it would be up to the individual, but as a whole, I should think it is a Jedi's calling to teach, as well as to protect.

Ty wrote: But isn't it part of the duty of a Jedi to find out the truth, when possible, and act as mediator? To resolve conflict?

In the movies and books, yes.

If someone is clearly in the wrong, and some people just cannot see it, isn't it the path of the Jedi to work with that?

Who are we really to judge the validity of another or their work?

McTaggert is clearly wrong, and her stances on health and vaccines cause measurable harm. That is not an opinion, that is medical fact, supported by mountains of evidence.

And as information changes it is important to continue to learn. But is it not also important to know where ones "knowledge" once was?

Shouldn't it be a Jedi's calling to be open to such a conclusion, to gain knowledge?

Knowledge that can be measured and weighed is not the end of wisdom or learning. It is the beginning. And from that beginning we reach for understanding through knowledge, focus, wisdom and the Force.

Wisdom is in the application of knowledge, so then it would be up to the individual, but as a whole, I should think it is a Jedi's calling to teach, as well as to protect.

It is a Jedi's calling to understand, be compassionate, and the courage of our convictions. Life will teach the lessons and that is guided by the Force.