Why do people here feel unimportant?

hmm

E-3_4L_Teeter wrote:

Br. John wrote: Well Adi, since you feel like shit and it's all because of a community I founded - I'll certainly take any suggestions on how I can make you feel better? If it's something I can do within reason I'll do my best.

OK. I was reading through this before and I caught sight of this. No offense, but this came off really condescending. Like a store manager being passive aggressive to a customer that has a problem. I can appreciate that sometimes, conflicts occur. But we're better than being condescending about someone's opinion.

It is practically a truism of online communication that the receiver can sometimes read into a message something that was not intended and thereby take offense, or at least feel stung. Should we all endeavor to be more caring and precise in how we say things, to try to minimize the chance that our words will be taken in a way we did not intend? Hell yes. Should we all also endeavor to see past our first-blush impressions of what we think someone is saying or how they are saying it? Also yes.

I quote you not because I think you are wrong, Teeter. On the contrary, I believe that when one of us (everyone, from guest to councilor) is not taking sufficient care with our words and thereby creating negative impressions, we should be gently called out on it. I wish only to address the broader point that a large part of the problem that I have seen over these past few weeks stems from both sides of the communication equation, from careless phrasing on the part of the senders, and from the receivers sometimes assuming offense where likely none lies.

people judge, take things personally, hold grudges, and look down their noses at each other

thats just the way of the world and we are all guilty of it some time or another

i would recommend not expecting to receive very much from any online community, but rather to focus on what you can provide and how you can contribute to it

Atticus509 wrote: Should we all also endeavor to see past our first-blush impressions of what we think someone is saying or how they are saying it? Also yes.

Dear god, yes. There should be a class for this... as in "you cannot connect to the internet until you pass it". I'd still be in remedial training xD

I believe that when one of us (everyone, from guest to councilor) is not taking sufficient care with our words and thereby creating negative impressions, we should be gently called out on it. I wish only to address the broader point that a large part of the problem that I have seen over these past few weeks stems from both sides of the communication equation, from careless phrasing on the part of the senders, and from the receivers sometimes assuming offense where likely none lies.

Yep.

I believe that when one of us (everyone, from guest to councilor) is not taking sufficient care with our words and thereby creating negative impressions, we should be gently called out on it. I wish only to address the broader point that a large part of the problem that I have seen over these past few weeks stems from both sides of the communication equation, from careless phrasing on the part of the senders, and from the receivers sometimes assuming offense where likely none lies.

It's probably wise that we train ourselves to make a habit of asking questions of clarification upon noticing when we are having a negative, impulsive reaction to a post.

"Could you rephrase what you're saying here? I don't know for sure that I'm understanding what you mean, and I don't wish to respond on a false assumption"

This is the route I would suggest, since it is probably the least potentially antagonistic route than "calling one out". Regardless of how gently it may be, our reaction in the moment can still charge our wording beyond what would really make it "gentle".

Proteus wrote:
It's probably wise that we train ourselves to make a habit of asking questions of clarification upon noticing when we are having a negative, impulsive reaction to a post.

"Could you rephrase what you're saying here? I don't know for sure that I'm understanding what you mean, and I don't wish to respond on a false assumption"

^I think promoting this kind of empathy is just what each of us (and really the world at large) needs.

Proteus wrote:

I believe that when one of us (everyone, from guest to councilor) is not taking sufficient care with our words and thereby creating negative impressions, we should be gently called out on it. I wish only to address the broader point that a large part of the problem that I have seen over these past few weeks stems from both sides of the communication equation, from careless phrasing on the part of the senders, and from the receivers sometimes assuming offense where likely none lies.

It's probably wise that we train ourselves to make a habit of asking questions of clarification upon noticing when we are having a negative, impulsive reaction to a post.

"Could you rephrase what you're saying here? I don't know for sure that I'm understanding what you mean, and I don't wish to respond on a false assumption"

This is the route I would suggest, since it is probably the least potentially antagonistic route than "calling one out". Regardless of how gently it may be, our reaction in the moment can still charge our wording beyond what would really make it "gentle".

A lot of the time what people see as me being "impulsively angry" is not an unfiltered snap reaction as much as me needing to get in front of the further abuse that comes with a post. It is a habit in online communities, this one included, for someone who receives a negative comment to get kicked by 3 of their friends, to have hurtful jokes made about them, etc. Despite what anyone says, the cliques here are a reality. I've only been here for 3 months and it's happened to me about a dozen times; the same people beating me up after someone has given the kill command. And I'm sure there are people who have noticed my initial post being made, then it being edited and refined, sometimes up to about 20 times before I walk away. *If I had time to wait a day before responding as I do in my journal, believe me, I would, but I'm not interested in coming back to myself having been skinned alive and my real intentions ruined for 3 pages.* People tend to believe what they read the most of. I'm not saying that you all can't think and figure it out for yourselves, but that you frequently won't take the time.

I'm also not foolish enough to think that a conversation is just about what you and I are saying to each other either. There are dozens of people that read a post without saying a word to anyone. I'm sometimes even more interested in those people's opinions of me because I'm unlikely to change your mind anyway. And yes, it does matter, because when I'm done being the person taking action and fighting the uphill skirmish, I might need a friend. Having other people control my image and ability to talk to that 3rd party because I didn't defend myself in a timely fashion is not among my interests. And I know people will jump in and say "I don't care what anyone says about me, I'm happy to stand alone", but I lived that way for two decades. I'm tired of being alone. I'm tired of having my appearance controlled by those without my best interests at heart.

I realize the irony that my attempts to defend myself against incoming attacks results in actual attacks, but to me the benefits outweigh the cost most of the time. I'd rather make my own real mistakes than let other people dictate who I am.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have to edit this 47 times xD

Snowy Aftermath wrote: There are dozens of people that read a post without saying a word to anyone. I'm as interested in those people's opinions of me too. And yes, it does matter, because when I'm done being the person taking action and fighting the uphill skirmish, I might need a friend.

* Raises hand * You've got a friend right here. You're high energy and sometimes highly-strung, and I love it! :kiss:

Manu wrote:

Snowy Aftermath wrote: There are dozens of people that read a post without saying a word to anyone. I'm as interested in those people's opinions of me too. And yes, it does matter, because when I'm done being the person taking action and fighting the uphill skirmish, I might need a friend.

* Raises hand * You've got a friend right here. You're high energy and sometimes highly-strung, and I love it! :kiss:

Hehe, thanks, Manu. You're a good potato xD

Snowy,
It helps me to remember that anytime I speak up here, I'm likely doing so in front of an audience of 200-300 people. Sometimes it's more. All of those people have opinions and may have issues with others here. It can seem to be a powder keg waiting for a match sometimes.

Then again, most of us are here because we are practicing Jedi, and as Jestor likes to say, we are "practicing, not perfect".

Everyone here has contributed in one way or another to my growth and experience of this Temple. Three months or three years, it doesn't matter. The conversations will be repeated and battles will be fought more than once. With every peek I get behind a new curtain here, I see conversations that are new to me, but have likely been had a thousand times before.

To feel unimportant, attacked, or outside the clique is to forget that we're all connected. What I do to you, I do to myself. What I say to you, I say to myself. It is wise to remember this when we feel like attacking others.