Hey! Let's Open The Vaccination Can Of Worms!

Gisteron wrote: suffer measurable consequences?

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21350943

activity of low doses of Thimerosal against isolated human and animal brain cells was found in all studies and is consistent with Hg (mercury) neurotoxicity

Thimerosal at concentrations relevant for infants' exposure (in vaccines) is toxic to cultured human-brain cells and to laboratory animals.

doses relevant to TCV (Thimerosal containing vaccines) exposure possess the potential to affect human neuro-development.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XU8nSn5Ezd8

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Gisteron wrote: Your comparsion is invalid

No Sir. It is not.

im not informed enough to announce that anyone else SHOULD accept my view

but as a general rule i think its a bad idea to use poison in medicine

imo we should only use things that we know to have a poisoneous effect in situations where we want to achieve the results of poisoning

if we dont want poison we should make stuff only with materials that dont poison

thats all - enjoy

•An estimated 450,000 preventable medication-related adverse events occur in the U.S. every year.
•The costs of adverse drug reactions5 to society are more than $136 billion annually -- greater than the total cost of cardiovascular or diabetic care.
•Adverse drug reactions cause injuries or death in one of five hospital patients.

References:
Hanlon JT, Pieper CF, Hajjar ER, Sloane RJ, Lindblad CI, Ruby CM,Schmader KE. Incidence and Predictors of All and Preventable Adverse Drug Reactions in Frail Elderly Persons after Hospital Stay. Journals of Gerontology A Biol Sci Med Sci. 2006 May;61(5):511-5
Buerhaus PI, Needleman J. Policy implications of research on nurse staffing and quality of patient care. Policy Politics Nurs Practice 2000; 1(1):5-15.


I could not find reliable stats that are within the last 5 years, but estimations are at 2.3 million drug related admissions to hospital for adverse reactions to correctly used prescription drugs.



If you're worried about drugs not poisoning people, then you've got a much bigger issue on your hands than just vaccines. And anything can be dangerous when incorrectly used. Hell, you can even die from drinking too much water.

i agree its hard to talk people out of being absurd

i used to run around the internet telling anyone who would listen that prescription drugs correcltly prescribed kill more people than all illegal drugs combined


that was at least ten years ago but its likely still true

and the fact that we poison ourselves as much as possible and with every opportunity we can come up with just seems to me to be a good argument for why we should change our fundamental doctrine into "if you wouldnt eat it and feed it to your children, in large doses, dont feed it to anybody"

its not an impossible goal imo and its certainly a worthy one

OB1Shinobi wrote: i used to run around the internet telling anyone who would listen that prescription drugs correcltly prescribed kill more people than all illegal drugs combined

that was at least ten years ago but its likely still true

Still true.

OB1Shinobi wrote: and the fact that we poison ourselves as much as possible and with every opportunity we can come up with just seems to me to be a good argument for why we should change our fundamental doctrine into "if you wouldnt eat it and feed it to your children, in large doses, dont feed it to anybody"

its not an impossible goal imo and its certainly a worthy one

I've never had measles or whooping cough. I've survived encephalitis and flu. I've not died of infection from injuries. I am an avid student and user of less engineered medicine and traditional treatments as far as is possible, but I sure as hell want the drugs if im that sick!

I think that the problem with our "doctrine" as you call it, is the all or nothing approach. As I mentioned earlier in the thread. Its about the compromises we are willing to make.

i agree with the spirit of what you say

this particular topic is outside of my areas of study and it looks to be one of those issues where both sides are more right in their own ways than wrong and both are equally well intentioned

i have to admit that on this topic i can venture some opinion but i dont have anything i feel confident presenting as an answer

Red_Eye_Jedi wrote:

Gisteron wrote: suffer measurable consequences?

First of all, it says "suffer" which for some reason you didn't conveniently quote mine away like you did with the rest of the embarassingly short post. Secondly I asked for something close to all people who took the vaccine, not something like a few cells that took the toxin. I did so, if you remember, because from razor-blade umbrellas close to all people who took those would also suffer measurable consequences. In other words I applied your ridiculous comparison to show how it maps to the thing it was supposedly a metaphor for.


You are free to be wrong on the internet all you like, but if you are going to quote mine with the intent to deceive and mislead people, as apparently you repeatedly do in this thread, you are gonna be called out on it.

Brenna wrote: And anything can be dangerous when incorrectly used. Hell, you can even die from drinking too much water.

Brenna,

Dimethylmercury is one of the most potent neurotoxins we have EVER discovered.

We are talking about a substance that has killed people who dropped a few drops of it on their latex gloves, and the amount that was able to pass through the latex gloves still killed them.

www.osha.gov/dts/hib/hib_data/hib19980309.html

Red_Eye_Jedi wrote:

Brenna wrote: And anything can be dangerous when incorrectly used. Hell, you can even die from drinking too much water.

Brenna,

Dimethylmercury is one of the most potent neurotoxins we have EVER discovered.

We are talking about a substance that has killed people who dropped a few drops of it on their latex gloves, and the amount that was able to pass through the latex gloves still killed them.

www.osha.gov/dts/hib/hib_data/hib19980309.html

As I recall you were discussing thimerosal, not dimethyl mercury.

And I wasn't discussing either of those things.

Brenna wrote: Its about the compromises we are willing to make.

There is absolutely no reason to compromise, we can indeed make vaccines without using mercury based preservatives.