Knights of Awakening: Jedi Safe Spaces (Charles McBride)

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24 Jul 2016 03:00 #249097 by Rex
The video was utter crock shit.
Division creates an us vs them mentality. The idea of this video is that people of his group don't have to accomodate people who disagree with them. Ultimately, we don't have to respect safe spaces, but I personally do.
My views on safe spaces are rather set at this point, after working in assisted living with a small platoon of cranky vets. They joked about their fears and prejudices (old people tend to be super racist, and one of them was Japanese). They're the exact opposite of the stereotypical safe space advocate who tend to decry privelege and expect their lives to be red carpeted.
Personally, I do try to respect and accomodate others. "As far as it is up to you, live at peace with everyone" is my mantra here. If I know someone has a legitimate condition or negative experience with something, I'll try to avoid it. If someone is just being sensitive, I ignore it and let them change. The original concept of safe space really is just common courtesy, but SJW divas go beyond that to extents everyone else thinks laughable.
I treat everyone equally. Marx said "from each according to ability, to each according to need." I apply that to my expectations, if someone grew up in a traphouse, I don't expect a Oxford tinged academic and give them certain leniency. Personally, I don't think people are entitled to anything beyond their personal freedom. I hold myself to a higher standard than everyone else since, like a good Pokemon trainer, I want to be the very best.

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24 Jul 2016 03:39 - 24 Jul 2016 03:39 #249100 by Alethea Thompson

Adder wrote:

Connor L. wrote: Listen and think.

Is this the right direction for Jedi to go?


Jedi in the fiction for example don't even have to be human so... I tend to agree. Division creates division. If you don't want to be racist, don't see colour when you look at someone.


Except, that this is equally "racist".

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Last edit: 24 Jul 2016 03:39 by Alethea Thompson.

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24 Jul 2016 03:43 #249101 by Adder

Alethea Thompson wrote:

Adder wrote:

Connor L. wrote: Listen and think.

Is this the right direction for Jedi to go?


Jedi in the fiction for example don't even have to be human so... I tend to agree. Division creates division. If you don't want to be racist, don't see colour when you look at someone.


Except, that this is equally "racist".


Can you clarify that? I define racism as discrimination based on race. Not looking at someones skin colour as a means to reduce the likeleehood of being racist doesn't seem to fit that description to me.

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24 Jul 2016 07:00 #249105 by Gisteron
So I scanned over the thread. Understanding the kind of thread a question of this kind produces I expect it will progress faster than I for one can keep up with it anyway, so you'll forgive me if I didn't read everything everybody says. I also suspect that what I am about to address is not much of a center of discussion so far.

Here is the thing about those gatherings and workshops: Sure, they're fun, interesting, sometimes educational to some, the list goes on. What's a typical turn up rate in Jedi gatherings? 100? 300? I'll be generous and give it a thousand. Say a third of that at any given time is engaged in one of ten workshops. That's about an average of 30 people per workshop. I'd expect more something on the order of a dozen when there is only three workshops at a time, but as stated before, we're being generous here - make it 30.
Compare that to an internet audience. Is there any time of the day when TOTJO has a two-digit concurrent visitor count? What about its Facebook site? I see some 650ish people talking about that page right now. And that's just one site! Make a remotely popular article and you'll have not 30 people listening but more like 30 000!
Technology brings us together faster and in greater numbers than any real life congregation could hope to. There are threads on this forum with more views than the count of all Jedi gathering attendees in history combined. The worst thing that can happen to those gatherings is that either they lose the breath of life, to the extent that they had any in the first place, or that a workshop or a lack thereof might "poison" fewer minds than there are fingers on my hand. Call me a millennial hipster, but I don't feel like either is much of a loss, all things considered. The mental battles we fight here have far greater impact on the community as a whole.
And there is another argument from internet in here, too. Consider for a comparison what the worst thing is that could happen to an online community? Well, since everybody is free to create their own place, either to have a safe space of their own, or to escape that very notion, really, the worst thing that can happen to a community is a split, where one part shifts to a place of free discourse while the other fades out into irrelevance.
The information age moved us past the times when we could subdue dissenters and get away with it. Everything that tries to reintroduce that, succeeds only on laughably insignificant scopes. It is no doubt sad that it does at all, but it is also inevitable. It is however not dangerous and to me neither worrysome.

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24 Jul 2016 08:14 #249114 by
Ah, well, rednecks. What can you do ?? ..... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

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24 Jul 2016 14:53 #249129 by steamboat28

Silas Mercury wrote: Ah, well, rednecks. What can you do ?? ..... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


...you rang? :angry:

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24 Jul 2016 15:07 - 24 Jul 2016 15:10 #249130 by
To start, I resent the idea that because something was done a certain way at a certain time in the past that that is inherently better which I feel is implied by McBride's commentary. At the same time, I also believe that just because a way of doings things is old or because something is old doesn't make it bad.

But McBride's commentary doesn't even make an attempt to understand why such a workshop would be considered as necessary and it seems more than a little suspect that as a white man he's proclaiming that there were no problems in the past. Furthermore, because he doesn't understand he has a misconception that a "safe space" is about feelings, about catering to special interests, about division. That's bollocks, a complete and utter reductive conception spoken out of ignorance. But I suppose none of that stuff would be important to someone whose society caters to his every whim, whose history is affirmed in textbooks, whose identity is never questioned, whose safety is not threatened because of who he is as a white man, etc. If his idea of division means that we don't all want to be become white men, or to behave as a white man behaves (even in his "best self" form) then I suppose I would say that there is some division.

About midway through the commentary, McBride says this is a waste of time. He recommends that instead there should be self-defense courses so that people could be physically and mentally prepared to defend themselves and they wouldn't need safe spaces. This is kinda ridiculous if you stop and think for a moment. Is punching my way out of every problem really how I can best represent my Jedi path? Last I checked, people didn't respond well when I took a scorched earth approach to handling aggressive people here at the Temple. People wanted me to talk things out, to educate, and to build empathy. That's what a goddamn safe space is for. I'm not asking anyone to protect my feelings. My feelings get hurt when it rains on days I wanted to spend outside, there's nothing anyone can do about the rain and I am not asking you to fix that.

McBride is yet another whiny member of the old guard who refuses to accept change, refuses to understand anything beyond what he already understands, and thinks the Jedi have lost their way because they no longer cater to his personal view of what Jedi should be. And you know what? I'd love to have some practical workshops like CPR, first aid, search and rescue, survival training, and all that stuff. I really would. I love that stuff because some of it might help and other aspects of it are just fun to know. I live in an urban environment so teaching me to survive in the wilderness isn't exactly speaking to my needs, but I'm not going to gripe and moan about it because I could probably still learn something from it.

I can't take McBride seriously. His opinions are his and he's entitled to them, but they carry no weight with me.
Last edit: 24 Jul 2016 15:10 by .

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24 Jul 2016 15:53 - 24 Jul 2016 15:57 #249136 by
I believe the idea people "should be" something before they can become Jedi is inherently flawed, as is the implied "if I don't need it then no-one should need it", or worse "if I don't want it no-one can have it" egotism. It's very unbecoming of someone who is evidently standing on the platform of being a "seasoned Jedi". One would hope a little compassion would have seeped in over the years he's been practicing; seems like he's still got a long way to go. That's OK.

If you're very secure in yourself, confident enough (which may not be very confident) and ready for it, a self defence course makes a lot of sense. If you're not, but you believe in the Force and the Jedi project, probably not. Better to secure the foundation, sort out the plumbing and fit the lighting than start with the turrets.

Getting a lot of this "old Jedi were better Jedi" vibe Jamie describes. That's an attitude I have yet to see evidence of, once, in three years. This rant, deemed so worthy it's been recorded and shared for posterity, is another example of the scale tipping the other way.

To Charles: look deeper.
Last edit: 24 Jul 2016 15:57 by .

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24 Jul 2016 16:50 #249141 by

Silas Mercury wrote: Ah, well, rednecks. What can you do ?? ..... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


If this were a redneck problem it probably wouldn't be a problem or at least it wouldn't be as a big of problem. While there may be problems of ignorance and foolishness among working class whites, it's a little more than reductive to simply write off ignorance as a redneck problem.

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24 Jul 2016 17:23 #249145 by

Jamie Stick wrote:

Silas Mercury wrote: Ah, well, rednecks. What can you do ?? ..... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


If this were a redneck problem it probably wouldn't be a problem or at least it wouldn't be as a big of problem. While there may be problems of ignorance and foolishness among working class whites, it's a little more than reductive to simply write off ignorance as a redneck problem.

I'm not so willing to write off the "what can you do?" part, either.

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