Holocrons and the New Canon

Trisskar wrote: Gray is a Choice to do things your own way above School Rules. AKA your miscreants, Slack off's, rule breakers, gangsters, bullies.....so forth and so on....

People over dramatize this whole "Balance" Ideal thinking its some god send. Apparently its cool to be above the laws and rules

Oh come on Trisskar, you gotta admit that breaking a few rules and living outside anyone's preconceived notion of what your "supposed to be doing" is maybe a little bit of fun, right? :silly: :evil:

That doesn't necessarily make you a "gansta" - It might just make you a free spirited independent thinker. Its these sorts of people that blaze new trails into the unknown and, in our example here, find deeper meanings in The Force than any followed dogma or set of rules could ever hope to achieve.

You are right. However some of the "Gray" Jedi in fiction were indeed 'Gangsta' like. (And I do believe we are talking about fiction yes? )

In fiction "Gray Jedi" were Jedi who left the order and in the case of some, put their services to the sith. Just like everything its individual

Just because you tamper with the darkside dosn't mean you are wise or more balanced. Just means your tampering with the darkside.

These "Deeper Meanings" is purely personal not movement based

Yes Jedi outcasts may have followed this path but there are many other force sensitive groups outside the Jedi or the Sith that just walked the line between light and dark. The Je'daii being the most prominent but there were other groups as well like the Krath, sorcerers of Tund, Jal Shey, Baron Do Sages, Dagoyan Masters, Force Witches of Dathomir just to name a few. Many of these groups strive for a balanced view of the force.

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: Force Witches of Dathomir

Im sorry.....but you and I are going to have to dissagree on the view points here. Except for Je'daii all the groups you listed did not "Strive" for "Balance" Especially the witches of Dathomir who more like prefered to dominate than balance hahaha

LOL, I guess it depends on your view of "Balance". It is not synonymous with harmony. I think the Jedi are another example of a philosophy out of balance so far it becomes derogatory.

Only in one case of your list of schools. All the others were meerly force sensative groups doing their own thing their own way. Which has nothing to do with "Balance"


Jal Shey - Negotiators (Good debaters) Intellectual forsaking spiritual ideals for more logical pursuits <- Not balance

Krath, sorcerers of Tund - Sorcerers, deception, concealment. Outcasts of Pure Blooded Sith who prefered to do things their own way - Not balance

Baron Do Sages - Philisophical. They studied things more philisophicaly and allowed their students to pick and choose what they wanted. Some were more physical than others and for the longest time followed false idealogies. - Not Balance

Dagoyan Masters - Pacifist. They saught HARMONY of the universe. - Not Balance. (Balance and Harmony are two different things)

Do those things make them Gangsters though? While in some cases it may, I would say in others it does not. Its just each groups attempts to find an equilibrium in the force. And yes I would say the Je'daii were probably the most successful in that for the greatest amount of time.

In the end it was not their philosophy that destroyed them but uncontrolled deviation from their philosophies that caused the Force Wars in the first place. From that rose two separate and unbalanced factions in the Jedi and the Sith, thus creating division and the illusion of separateness where none was really ever meant to exist. It only follows that re-integration of these two factions into a single balanced state once again is the only thing that will bring harmony back to the force doesn't it? Not the domination of one faction over the other.

Kyrin.....You are taking 1 thing and forcing it into a galaxy full of unrelated things.

Back track.

I said that Grey Jedi were Jedi who disavowed Jedi Rules and that by doing so they had the potential of falling into a category, one such category was of a gangter practice in which they attempted to serve Sith against their Jedi Breatheran in some of the major wars.

That has nothing to do with Any other school that practices the force

That has nothing to do with the Gray Jedi who simply did their own thing (Such as Correllion Jedi or even Qui Gon Jin)

That has nothing to do with any of the points you have brought up so far because.....They are all unrelated to the subject I was referring to.

So to answer you current question

Do those things make them Gangsters though?

Of course not. Because I was not talking about them

Its just each groups attempts to find an equilibrium in the force

As I pointed out....these groups were not attempting to find any kind of balance or equilibrium or whatever you want to call it They were trying to do things their own way for their own gains. Simple as that.

And yes I would say the Je'daii were probably the most successful in that for the greatest amount of time.

Actually.....they died out rather quickly

It only follows that re-integration of these two factions into a single balanced state once again is the only thing that will bring harmony back to the force doesn't it?

No. Because the galaxy dosn't work like that. The only reason why Je'daii strived for a perfect balance was because the planet they lived on would have destroyed them if they didn't. Too much dark energy wrecked massive storms that would kill them all, too much lightside stagnation and equal death.

Living in this purpetual state of unrest between white and black is and was proven to be quite unhealthy.


Buuuuuut.....Im afraid you and I are getting way off topic here Perhaps we should have a admin split us....

LOL fair enough. I thought you were trying to include any non Jedi Force user in your gangsta analogy.
My mistake!

Although I still disagree with you on your last point. I think Tython was representative of the function of the Galaxy in general. It is a physical warning of the dangers of straying to far to the right or the left. Even so, as I think we have both said, balance does not equal harmony, it just equals balance. Balance is about denying neither side of our personality but embracing both equally. This is the best way to navigate those internal emotional storms that rage inside each of us. And in that, the Micro reflects the Macro. Harmony is about integrating those storms with your greater surroundings.

lol or maybe I'm waaaay overthinking all this!

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: lol or maybe I'm waaaay overthinking all this!

Uuuum.....yes. You are the authors of these books were not trying to provide philosophical ideals. They were writing stories. Therefor

I think Tython was representative of the function of the Galaxy in general.

Tython was a planet. Nothing more or less. It was not meant to represent the galaxy at all haha And even in a philosophical sense....it is a very very poor way to expect anyone to live their lives. IMO and is in no way a "Better" practice as was originally suggested in Force Users comment

Grey Jedi (Of which he specifically asked about) were akin to drop outs and rule breakers. I specifically made these distinctions because real world Jedi tend to over fantasize the idea of using dark and lightside without understanding the repercussions of what that actually entails.