What does being a member of the group "Jedi" mean to you?

Goken wrote:
I feel like that's a pretty good analogy. :laugh: I do believe, however, that at least a small majority here agree on the doctrine in general, just not on the interpretations or applications of it.

Thanks! Yes I would agree completely about the doctrine group. I would consider that another subset group as I described above about the Sith subset. This "doctrine" group tries to follow the doctrine on this site as it was written and try to live up to that code as Dude says above. but not all Jedi do this. Other Jedi at other temples do the same for their particular code. Christian Jedi do this as well for a version of code they find meaningful and so forth. But beyond that I wanted to try to get to the underlying philosophy that binds all these groups together.

Goken wrote:

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: These are interesting thoughts. LOL sort of reminds me of the island of misfit toys. Not to say that anyone is broken but its just the idea that we are all different enough as individuals to have very diverse philosophies, but at the same time similar enough in some way to cling to one another and form a group.

It seems that just our diversity would not be enough to hold us together. So what is it about us that is similar enough that we find comfort in as a group? Do you think it nothing more than the paradox of the island of misfit toys? Meaning each of us as individuals have searched but have found no meaning in other groups/spiritualitys. So we have come together in an ironic group called Jedi because we have that one thing in common, that we find it impossible to conform to any one preset doctrine. We each have radically diverse and individual spiritual paths that we carve out for ourselves vs following a crowd. We are nietzsche's uber-mensch and in that we find a commonality?

I feel like that's a pretty good analogy. :laugh: I do believe, however, that at least a small majority here agree on the doctrine in general, just not on the interpretations or applications of it.

The Doctrine is pretty universal and easy to follow for the most part. Myself I simply dislike the Name "Doctrine" and alot of the interpretations/descriptions and.....Its way more lengthy than it needs to be. Very repetitive.....But the Ideals are no different than any other Jedi group with their own sets of behaviors/codes/tenets.

Being a Jedi was once about discovering myself and to train to be better than I was....And then I reached that Gauntlet.

Then it became about the community and how I might be apart of it's evolution and growth....And then I reached that Gauntlet.

Now it's about setting up my own legacy so that one day my daughters can learn about the best of themselves and find an honorable direction in life.

The meaning and purpose of being apart of a Jedi Group or the community in general - is to follow your own Hero's Journey that lead you here. Perhaps it will one day lead you away from it...or perhaps you will forever hug the edges as you continue forward. That is indiidual.

@ triskar

I can understand that. I have followed a similar path in my journey as a pagan. I had that season of deep intospection, that one of selfless sacrifice to community, that selfish one of deep training just for me and so on. Do you think we as Jedi find ourselves seeking that group of kindred spirits that are walking separate paths but also somewhat parallel paths? We follow our heros journey but through the thick of the wood we see others also walking towards what seems to be a similar destiny and we can wave at them and say hi, maybe even share a meal. And we find a comfort in the fact that we are not alone in this dark wood that we have decided to tread but where most others fear to go. This seems the very core of what Cayce touched on with the idea that we seek to challenge ourselves at every opportunity physically, mentally and spiritually. We never turn down that "heros journey" in any aspect and when we find others of similar ilk we are drawn to them. And that is what binds us as Jedi at a most basic level?

From my experience it is just the name. Get rid of the name and watch the numbers die out with a quickness.... :dry: But I suppose that could just be my pessimist shadow seeping out it is past midnight here.... :whistle:

The name is Appealing. Its represents the best parts of what we all want to be...so we cling to it.

I wish I could say it is because we are drawn to the people in the community....And while parts of it might be true there is equal measure of people here we don't care for and often but heads with....Force knows there are plenty in the community I could live without :whistle: :dry: So....Why stay?

So its the ideologies that appeal to us. The Doctrines/Codes/Tenets/Teachings..... Except that these things are found in many faiths and belief systems. Not Just for Jedi. So....why not just be Pagan and stick to it? If that is truly what you are most familiar and comfortable with why bother trying to make something else work when it clearly doesn't? For me it could be because....even though I have encountered plenty of unpleasant people in the Jedi Community....I have also made some real close friends. I stay....because of them...And even that has been....faltering.

But now we get to the part that many here don't like Experience. Myself I have stuck to this for a very...very...long time. I have poured so much heart and soul into this single word "Jedi." that it is hard for me to just turn around and walk away. I have suffered great pains and experienced great joys and it takes up a great measure of my life since I was sixteen...

And so that is the crux of the matter. At least to me

Each of us stumbled upon this community by one means or another. We found things that was interesting....some things that were not so much....and over days....weeks...months....years....we weigh and measure its worth and in that course...make friends and personal soul deep history.

Like attracts like.

okay....now im just rambling aimlessly....I best try that whole "Sleep" thing....Night!

I think jedi sounds cool. Imagine if Lucas had called them the "splurts" or something like that. :laugh:

What I find holds us and calls to us as a group is enlightenment. We all have found our own truths to the world. We have learned ourselves and our place in the world. It is the search for our own personal truth that binds us.

steamboat28 wrote: My major problem is that, moreso perhaps than any other religion, we all point at the same source material and wildly, wildly diverge from it. It's true there were many kind of Jedi in both canon and the newly-defunct EU writings, but we don't even necessarily hold together that well. It's interesting that we all choose to use the same word to describe something that is so wildly, vastly different from one another, and I'm curious if it just comes down to interpretation of that original source material, or if the word itself has been forgotten as a part of this movement.

It's always been that way. Our differences (oddly enough) are what make us whole. Like my friend Tionne from Jedi Creed used to say, we're all part of a mosaic:

The Mosaic

A mosaic is a picture comprised of many different colors and materials, all forming one picture. A shard of yellow topaz could form the center of a flower, with bits and pieces of green glazed tile for grass and leaves, and bits of white porcelain for the petals. Around that could be lapis lazuli for the sky, and perhaps diamonds for stars. Terra cotta tiles could form the trunk of a tree, or perhaps a rock. Yet all these many pieces comprise one picture, with no one segment any more or less important or useful than the rest. We are all a mosaic. We are all the lapis lazuli sky. We are all the diamond stars, the terra cotta rocks, the green tile grass and leaves, the topaz and porcelain flowers. We each have our own color and texture to add to the human experience. We all have our own different lives to add to the bigger life Force. We are all different, and yet we are all one. Our differences unify us, just as many different colors and textures form the mosaic.

—Tionne

Trisskar wrote: From my experience it is just the name. Get rid of the name and watch the numbers die out with a quickness.... :dry: But I suppose that could just be my pessimist shadow seeping out it is past midnight here.... :whistle:

The name is Appealing. Its represents the best parts of what we all want to be...so we cling to it.

Thats been my dilema, i cant decide if there is nothing more to jediism than a name or a movie which to me leaves us just sort of pretending to be something we are really not. Or is there some deeper inderlying philosopy that has been tapped into, even if accidently that we are striving as a group to develop.

I know what you mean about the people. For me its not the relationships im developing so much as the attraction to the heros journey philosophy that we have undertaken. However i still cant decide if all or even most jedi have that same focus or if they are more enamored by the name as you say. Thats the reason for my inquiry here. To get other opinions.

I get what your saying about the investment in time in a community as well. I have experienced something similar in my pagan path. Invest all to have it shatterd at some point and then having to make the decision to either carry on with the lie or leave the path you were on. Its a hard decision to make. In my case i chose to leave and ironically that decision was what brought me to explore jediism.

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: Thats been my dilema, i cant decide if there is nothing more to jediism than a name or a movie which to me leaves us just sort of pretending to be something we are really not. .

The greatest strength of Jediism is that we know its mythology is fictional. So, if you want to take the traditional approach towards fitting into a religion, from the very start you are pretending to be something that you are really not. And as long as you keep trying to fit in, you will forever be overly concerned with definitions, labels and what is and not Jedi.

Or, you can simply enjoy the fact that there is nothing to fit into. YOU make Jediism, not the other way around. After all, the purpose of myths and symbols are not for us to emulate them, but to use them as tools to discover who we are, what we want and more importantly, live accordingly.

Manu wrote:

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: Thats been my dilema, i cant decide if there is nothing more to jediism than a name or a movie which to me leaves us just sort of pretending to be something we are really not. .

The greatest strength of Jediism is that we know its mythology is fictional. So, if you want to take the traditional approach towards fitting into a religion, from the very start you are pretending to be something that you are really not. And as long as you keep trying to fit in, you will forever be overly concerned with definitions, labels and what is and not Jedi.

Or, you can simply enjoy the fact that there is nothing to fit into. YOU make Jediism, not the other way around. After all, the purpose of myths and symbols are not for us to emulate them, but to use them as tools to discover who we are, what we want and more importantly, live accordingly.

@Manu

I think you miss my point. Im not asking for a definition or a set of paramaters in a religious context that all "fit into". In fact the very thing im speaking of is the idea that there is no such thing. And yet, even though there is no such thing, there are those that choose to unify themselves under a common term called "jedi". So my questions is, beyond the doctrine and the movies and the subset groups and different individual spiritual paths why is it you choose to assiciate yourself with this group of people and call yourself Jedi? What is it that draws you to this association beyond the individual action and the various doctrines and the disparite beliefs? What is the underlying unifying thing that jedi recognize in each other beyond these things that tells them they are of kindred spirit?

This is actually a really good question. I've been giving it some thought and the only thing that comes to mind is that I seek to better myself continually. I don't expect everyone to agree with my philosophy and find many that do disagree with it here. I don't even expect everyone here to be a fan of Star Wars. I think being a Jedi is, as Proteus said, about living as a hero on our journey. It's about striving to do good in the world and seeking to better ourselves. Being a part of the Jedi community means being able to get along with a diverse group of people and find common ground with them even when we disagree on details.

To me there is a joy to being Jedi. The joys I receive will never be the same as any one else's, and that is ok by me. I enjoy the view of difrent spectrum here. I take the views to my own meditation and give them value and you know what happens for me any way , I'm a little more open minded. It wasn't that I was this great thing or smart person but I simply applied my practice my own Jedi ism in my every day, as I do here. You will rarely see me argue with any one here in the forum and that's never mynownnpersonal focus , but my goal is to build, never rare down. So , being in a community as this with a lot of difrent views and emotions and feelings and egos and all these things we are all working on meet, helps me personally some times to practice what I study . To be a part of a group to me, is a great thing, depending on the intention of the greatness is focuses. My focus is to build and grow so I use every power unity here to.

That is an awesome thought lykeios!! Maybe another piece of the puzzle. We are a diverse group and we all walk a seperate path as we strive to better ourselves in many ways. What better way to do that than to immerse ourselves in the most disparate and diverse set of people we can imaginally find! In that context this temple becomes a training ground for situations and people we will find in real life. Here we are constantly challenged to defend our beliefs and evolve our worldview but in a safe place one step removed from the rigors of real life. It teaches us not only philosophy but it also teaches patience, acceptance and a myriad of other skills among an incredibly diverse group of others who are trying to learn the same things!

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: So my questions is, beyond the doctrine and the movies and the subset groups and different individual spiritual paths why is it you choose to assiciate yourself with this group of people and call yourself Jedi? What is it that draws you to this association beyond the individual action and the various doctrines and the disparite beliefs? What is the underlying unifying thing that jedi recognize in each other beyond these things that tells them they are of kindred spirit?

I did go a bit off-topic before, didn't I? :laugh:

The point I was trying to make is that the conventional approach towards fitting into a religion is obsolete. Or at the very least, has resulted fruitless to the ones here. So it is precisely that openness to an unconventional, fluid approach that acknowledges a hidden common theme in all paths, that draws us together.

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: However i still cant decide if all or even most jedi have that same focus or if they are more enamored by the name as you say.

Obviously my experience's are not the sole example of Jedi. And I am not trying to suggest that my experience holds any credence. However....Just recently I have been trying to put together a ohio gathering for 2017, its been a rough process with alot of......politics. Anyways.... After alot of stressful work in an attempt to make it a solid plan, some of us decided to change the name. It was in part an experiment. We changed it from the 2017 Ohio Jedi Gathering to "Adventurer's Guild Double xp Weekend Extravaganza!" We followed the name change up with an explanation as to why we did it...and a promise that NOTHING else at all changed....Just the name. We had a person drop out not even 5 minuets after the change - All because the name "Jedi" was dropped.

I tried something similar in the past. Same codes, same beliefs, same teaching methods, same everything....But instead of Jedi and changed it to "Magi" and the forum/website was "The Jade Tower" Many conversations were had as to why individuals wouldn't join because it wasn't "Jedi" Specific.

Names hold alot of power and sway on peoples choices. Now....thats been changing with alot of the older people of the community who have had time and dirt in "Game" but there is something inspiring and drawing with the name.

Myself, I am trying to figure out how to transition all of my Just Jedi work back into the old "Magi" ideas....its just alot of tedius work haha.

Similarly, a Jedi friend and I have been working on training as "Sages" rather than Jedi, and there is literally zero interest when we talk to people about it.

But, when we came up with the same training program and called it a Grey Jedi training program, people went nuts and we had over 500 likes on FB within a week.

Names are extremely powerful.

Spiritual materialism is a b****.

Connor L. wrote: Spiritual materialism is a b****.

Truth.

...Not Much.

There you go.



My "Jedi Path" Or....whatever...is to me more akin to my local Lions Club and Freemasons, than a lot of what I perceive of the membership here - but I don't like selling fruit cakes for the former, or the dress standards of the latter :lol:


So, to call myself a Member of TotJO doesn't bolster the meaning of being a Jedi to me - but the doctrine here is reasonable, and while I can find what there is to learn from the members here that might have similar interests to me, and maybe I can accidentally persuade some of the members who are a bit more "vague" in their path at the moment to attempt a more purposeful way of living and serve people instead of themselves.




(So...yeah...trying to co-opt someone's fandom to make an army of intellectual moderates with a desire to work for humanity. Agendas. Agendas everywhere)

JamesSand wrote: ...Not Much.

There you go.



My "Jedi Path" Or....whatever...is to me more akin to my local Lions Club and Freemasons, than a lot of what I perceive of the membership here - but I don't like selling fruit cakes for the former, or the dress standards of the latter :lol:


So, to call myself a Member of TotJO doesn't bolster the meaning of being a Jedi to me - but the doctrine here is reasonable, and while I can find what there is to learn from the members here that might have similar interests to me, and maybe I can accidentally persuade some of the members who are a bit more "vague" in their path at the moment to attempt a more purposeful way of living and serve people instead of themselves.




(So...yeah...trying to co-opt someone's fandom to make an army of intellectual moderates with a desire to work for humanity. Agendas. Agendas everywhere)

I love this ! Because its not really about us is it? The Doctrine is a wonderfull guideline , but in the end its ..What can i do for others , thank you for reminding me James