Weekday Doctrine Meditations 13:00 utc(Ajax)

(05:04:53) Rosalyn_J: mornin
(05:05:08) Rosalyn_J: ah, hey E
(05:05:10) Proteus: hello
(05:05:15) Rosalyn_J: Lets get started
(05:05:17) Twigga: How're things for you today Ros, Proteus?
(05:05:26) Twigga: Sure
(05:05:48) Rosalyn_J: pretty good
(05:05:52) Rosalyn_J: you?
(05:06:12) Proteus: Not bad. Energy is a bit low but that's solvable.
(05:06:18) Twigga: Nice morning here. Rainy. I like rain.
(05:07:01) Twigga: *hands Proteus digital coffee*
(05:07:14) Rosalyn_J: ok here we are at #4
(05:07:17) Rosalyn_J: I think
(05:07:27) Rosalyn_J: 4. Jedi are wary of attachments, both material and personal. The obsession over possessions and people creates the fear of losing those possessions and relationships which can cause ourselves to be trapped in a state of depression and loss.
(05:08:05) Rosalyn_J: Thoughts here
(05:08:08) Rosalyn_J: ?
(05:08:41) Twigga: I kicked off a whole IP Study Hall thread about this one. The more I think about it, the more I find it disagrees with me.
(05:09:12) Rosalyn_J: how so?
(05:09:20) Temple remote: steamboat28 logs into the Chat.
(05:09:46) Proteus: Once a person truly realizes they will one day die, along with everyone else around them, it helps one to learn how to appreciate everything around them all the more. When the realization is true, they will no that clinging to anything is futile, and they will appreciate what there is for what it is in the moment.
(05:09:57) steamboat28: I think too many people are attached to the idea of attachments.
(05:10:28) Proteus: True appreciation comes from realizing its temperance.
(05:11:13) Twigga: Not caring about people and stuff also kinda sucks.
(05:11:24) Twigga: That's possibnly the safest way I can phrase it.
(05:11:30) steamboat28: i don't think attachment is "not caring".
(05:11:31) Proteus: If we think about how some people who have decided to kill themselves act, we see that many of them suddenly become very happy, and very deep, very honest.
(05:11:38) Rosalyn_J: People and things are not the only things we can be attached to
(05:11:40) steamboat28: or rather the lack of attachment isnt "not caring"
(05:11:51) Rosalyn_J: we can be attached to "ideas"
(05:11:51) Proteus: Because they have accepted their fate and know that nothing matters except for the experience they are having.
(05:12:27) steamboat28: Not having attachments is refusing to allow things to control you.
(05:12:33) Rosalyn_J: the same phenomenon can be seen with the terminally ill
(05:13:22) Rosalyn_J: people can also become attached to "status'" and "identities"
(05:13:26) steamboat28: My *** used to be attached to money, until I didn't have any, and learned there were still ways to eat without it.
(05:14:23) Rosalyn_J: I'm more attached to food than what we use to buy it
(05:14:37) Rosalyn_J: if someone cooks for me they are instantly my favorite person
(05:14:37) Twigga: ^
(05:14:45) Twigga: Come visit!
(05:15:18) steamboat28: I'm not "attached" to my friends or family in the Buddhist manner of speaking, though I care for them a very great deal. non-attachment isn't about apathy, it's about recognizing impermanence.
(05:15:32) Rosalyn_J: right
(05:15:40) Proteus: agreed
(05:15:57) Twigga: But you might need to get attached before you can be unattached?
(05:15:59) Rosalyn_J: if I may its also about allowing our minds/hearts to be open to new possibilities
(05:16:54) Proteus: how about attachment to one's self?
(05:16:54) Rosalyn_J: I think attachment now a day is a natural state because we are less communal and more individual
(05:17:01) Proteus: one's own beliefs and views
(05:17:08) Proteus: *convictions
(05:17:13) steamboat28: that's true. My grandfather used to say "I won't always be here to help you through these things." I knew one day I'd have to live in a world without his guidance, so I cherished it more while I was receiving it, because that new world was going to need those old teachings.
(05:17:21) Rosalyn_J: yeah thats what I was getting at a bit ago
(05:18:35) Rosalyn_J: we are coming up on the end of our time together
(05:18:38) steamboat28: Attachment to ideas is specifically terrifying to me, because it's what causes extremist fundamentalists.
(05:18:58) Twigga: I think attachment to self is pretty important; but we're not our beliefs/views/convictions.
(05:19:05) Rosalyn_J: well some of us have an attachment to the idea of Jedi
(05:19:22) Rosalyn_J: or to the idea of Knight
(05:19:42) Rosalyn_J: or Councillor or any number of things just here in this temple
(05:20:42) Twigga: (Thank a councillor today!) <- Attached to this thread. And the IP Study Hall chats.
(05:20:52) Twigga:
(05:21:07) Twigga: I think that's healthy attachment.
(05:21:29) Rosalyn_J: ok guys
(05:21:33) Twigga: But it could get out of hand if I mention it when Ros is trying to wrap up!
(05:21:40) Rosalyn_J: we've gotta wrap it up
(05:22:08) Rosalyn_J: more than welcome to continue the discussion after we are finished with the Creed
(05:22:18) Rosalyn_J: Ready?
(05:22:24) Twigga: yep
(05:22:34) Rosalyn_J: I am a Jedi an instrument of peace;
(05:22:44) Twigga: I am a Jedi an instrument of peace;
(05:23:16) Rosalyn_J: Where there is hatred, I shall bring love;
(05:23:31) Twigga: Where there is hatred, I shall bring Love;
(05:23:45) Rosalyn_J: Where there is injury, pardon;
(05:23:53) Twigga: Where there is injury, pardon;
(05:24:07) Rosalyn_J: Where there is doubt, faith;
(05:24:09) Twigga: Where there is doubt, faith;
(05:24:22) Rosalyn_J: Where there is despair, hope;
(05:24:27) Temple remote: Proteus has been logged out (Timeout).
(05:24:35) Twigga: Where there is despair, hope;
(05:24:50) Rosalyn_J: Where there is darkness, light;
(05:25:00) Twigga: Where ther is darkness, lig;
(05:25:04) Twigga: ht
(05:25:20) Rosalyn_J: And where there is sadness, Joy;
(05:25:32) Twigga: And where there is sadness, joy;
(05:25:38) Rosalyn_J: I am a Jedi
(05:25:44) Twigga: I am a Jedi
(05:25:59) Rosalyn_J: I shall never seek so much to be consoled as to console;
(05:26:23) Twigga: I shall never seek so much to be consoled as to console;
(05:26:30) Rosalyn_J: To be understood as to understand
(05:26:42) Twigga: To be understood as to understand;
(05:26:51) Rosalyn_J: To be loved as to love
(05:27:00) Twigga: To be loved as to Love;
(05:27:13) Rosalyn_J: For it is in giving that we receive;
(05:27:30) Twigga: For it is in giving that we recieve;
(05:27:44) Rosalyn_J: It is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
(05:27:54) Twigga: It is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
(05:28:13) Rosalyn_J: And it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.
(05:28:27) Twigga: And it isi in dying that we're born to eternal life.
(05:28:44) Rosalyn_J: The Force is with me always, for I am a Jedi.
(05:28:58) Twigga: The force is with me always, for I am a Jedi.
(05:29:23) Rosalyn_J: May the Force be with you all. Have a great (rest of your) day!!
(05:29:31) Twigga: Thanks Rosalyn!
(05:29:44) steamboat28:
(05:29:48) Twigga: All the best for your work day!

(05:00:44) Rosalyn_J: hey twigga
(05:01:00) Twigga: Hi Ros How are you?
(05:01:13) Rosalyn_J: pretty good
(05:01:16) Rosalyn_J: you?
(05:01:47) Twigga: Happy reconnected. Dinner with new friends last night.
(05:02:10) Rosalyn_J: woot
(05:02:20) Rosalyn_J: whats say we get started?
(05:02:26) Twigga: Sure
(05:02:42) Rosalyn_J: Here we are at the 5th teaching: Jedi understand that well-being consists in the physical, the mental and the spiritual. A Jedi trains each to ensure they remain capable of performing their duties to the best of their ability. All of these are interconnected and essential parts of our training in becoming more harmonious with the Force.
(05:03:20) Rosalyn_J: what are your thoughts?
(05:03:39) Twigga: I dunno for sure, but I feel like one of the IP essays comes out of this one - the "Body and mind" essay.
(05:04:00) Rosalyn_J: Right
(05:04:25) Twigga: Wrangling with that essay's been ... interesting
(05:05:00) Rosalyn_J: One of the mistakes I made early on in my training was trying to do practices for all three every day
(05:05:00) Twigga: So I am seeing the interconneded-ness of them all... but also the huge difficulty of balance.
(05:05:16) Twigga: yeah?
(05:05:27) Twigga: How was that for you?
(05:05:28) Rosalyn_J: Yes
(05:05:38) Rosalyn_J: I burned out quite quickly
(05:05:50) Rosalyn_J: I got frustrated and I beat myself up
(05:06:05) Rosalyn_J: because I was trying to meet a "standard"
(05:06:16) Twigga: Hah! Good thing to learn then - 'cause it SOUNDS sensible.
(05:06:42) Rosalyn_J: I know how I get when I "fail"
(05:06:58) Twigga: I liked Senan's line - something about - you're only trying to improve on yourself - you are your own standard.
(05:07:23) Rosalyn_J: so what I have learned to do is to develop a habit for one thing I want to increase in my life
(05:07:48) Rosalyn_J: right now, its physical wellness and the habit is going to the gym 3 times a week
(05:08:15) Twigga: *nods* that's cool.
(05:08:19) Rosalyn_J: I am quite happy to have a support which takes me to the gym, making the development of the habit a bit easier
(05:09:00) Rosalyn_J: I also know I like to go to extremes in these departments
(05:09:27) Rosalyn_J: If I didnt do physical exercise everyday it wasnt "good enough"
(05:09:44) Rosalyn_J: well one has to ask one's self, good enough for "who"?
(05:09:58) Twigga: ... balance again? With Senan's definition as the standard, self-love removes "fail".
(05:10:35) Rosalyn_J: remembering that is a daily, minute-ly, hourly thing
(05:11:18) Rosalyn_J: anyhow, what are your thoughts?
(05:12:09) Twigga: On doing one thing at a time? I'm a do what I feel like doing anytime kinda person.
(05:13:02) Twigga: On the basis that people are generally nice, most of the stuff I do is nice. I'm not too planned or worried about that.
(05:13:20) Rosalyn_J: that works too
(05:13:28) Twigga: But not EVERYTHING is nice - that's where the tweaking comes in
(05:13:36) Rosalyn_J: right
(05:16:07) Twigga: But I'm kinda new still to this whole "training/duty" stuff. I try my best to keep my commitments to myself. I keep those quite small and time limited in number. Not keeping a commitment to myself? I don't handle that well. But I feel THAT is outside the scope of this particular teaching.
(05:17:01) Twigga: I have committed to IP, however long it takes, and getting my body in better shape to "live a long time" until April 15th.
(05:17:26) Twigga: Brains wise, I commit to my work.
(05:17:49) Rosalyn_J: wait, I got confused
(05:18:05) Twigga: I see that a bit different from mental though - more intellectual.
(05:18:09) Rosalyn_J: you wanna live a long time til April 15?
(05:18:15) Twigga:
(05:18:53) Twigga: Nope - I want to commit to get my body in shape as though I am going to live a long time until April 15th.
(05:19:02) Twigga: Because I might
(05:19:06) Rosalyn_J: I see
(05:19:23) Rosalyn_J: well thats wonderful and this discussion has been great
(05:19:40) Rosalyn_J: Any last thoughts?
(05:19:42) Twigga: Not caring for it would make living a long time more difficult
(05:19:56) Rosalyn_J: right, I gotcha
(05:20:24) Twigga: I see mental and spiritual VERY interconnected. More so than with body.
(05:20:47) Rosalyn_J: so they are all not balanced in their connection?
(05:20:53) Twigga: But that's a perceptions thing. On that front, I think we're all different.
(05:21:07) Rosalyn_J: right
(05:21:08) Twigga: for me, they are not evenly weighted.
(05:21:24) Twigga: so everyone's "balance" will be different
(05:21:43) Twigga: and I wish you huge success in keeping your gym committments.
(05:21:43) Rosalyn_J: its hard for me to tell the difference between spiritual and mental
(05:21:57) Rosalyn_J: I been goin strong on that one
(05:22:14) Rosalyn_J: once the habit is firmly fixed I can move on to nutrition
(05:22:15) Twigga: yeah?
(05:22:23) Twigga: Nice.
(05:22:26) Rosalyn_J: yeah
(05:22:37) Twigga: Sounds tasty! Though I hope you still enjoy your ramen.
(05:22:37) Rosalyn_J: stared in October 2017
(05:23:07) Twigga: nice! Nearly 6 months then!
(05:23:12) Rosalyn_J: my focus on nutrition will have to include not eating out as often
(05:23:23) Twigga:
(05:23:32) Rosalyn_J: Oh when you say it like that it sounds wonderful!
(05:23:41) Twigga: Unofficial discord has a cooking channel if you want ideas!
(05:23:50) Twigga: It IS wonderful.
(05:23:52) Rosalyn_J: yeah I saw
(05:24:13) Twigga: Keeping commitments to yourself is one of the nicest things I think you can do for you.
(05:24:21) Temple remote: Proteus logs into the Chat.
(05:24:21) Twigga: I really enjoy it.
(05:24:28) Rosalyn_J: aw
(05:24:35) Rosalyn_J: E we are wrapping up
(05:24:48) Proteus: aw
(05:25:00) Rosalyn_J: more than welcome to have a discussion after the Creed though!
(05:25:21) Rosalyn_J: Ready twigga?
(05:25:30) Twigga: Typing fingers are go
(05:25:41) Rosalyn_J: Ready E?
(05:26:08) Rosalyn_J: I am a Jedi, an instrument of peace
(05:26:23) Twigga: I am a Jedi, an instrument of peace
(05:26:36) Rosalyn_J: Where there is hatred, I shall bring love;
(05:26:46) Twigga: Where there is hatred, I shall bring Love;
(05:26:59) Rosalyn_J: Where there is injury, pardon;
(05:27:11) Twigga: Where there is injury, pardon;
(05:27:37) Rosalyn_J: Where there is doubt, faith;
(05:27:43) Twigga: Where there is doubt, faith;
(05:27:56) Rosalyn_J: Where there is despair, hope;
(05:28:06) Twigga: Where there is despair, hope;
(05:28:17) Rosalyn_J: Where there is darkness, light;
(05:28:24) Twigga: Where there is darkness, light;
(05:28:41) Rosalyn_J: And where there is sadness, joy;
(05:28:48) Twigga: And where there is sadness, joy;
(05:28:59) Rosalyn_J: I am a Jedi.
(05:29:05) Twigga: I am a Jedi.
(05:29:23) Rosalyn_J: I shall never seek so much to be consoled as to console;
(05:29:39) Twigga: I shall never seek so much to be console as to console;
(05:29:56) Rosalyn_J: To be understood as to understand;
(05:30:05) Twigga: to be understood as to understand;
(05:30:14) Rosalyn_J: To be loved as to love;
(05:30:24) Twigga: to be loved as to Love ;
(05:30:37) Rosalyn_J: For it is in giving that we receive;
(05:30:48) Twigga: For it is in giving that we recieve
(05:31:04) Rosalyn_J: It is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
(05:31:15) Twigga: It is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
(05:31:34) Rosalyn_J: And it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.
(05:31:48) Twigga: And it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.
(05:32:07) Rosalyn_J: The Force is with me always for I am a Jedi.
(05:32:21) Twigga: The Force is with me always for I am a Jedi.
(05:32:32) Rosalyn_J: May the Force be with you all