Senior Knights

Well, idk 'monumerntal", lol...

but, that can be argued, that is for sure...

Originally, it was just a lesson bank for Knights to share things we all thought was important, it was not for the degree scheme, so, originally, it was for Knights only...

When the degree talk started, we said we could use those lessons as suggestions... And yes, for the basic degree, our basic learning seemed to make sense together...

As our degrees are, uh, 'ours'...

We can set up whatever criteria we choose...

I feel that, the Knighthood is minimum for a degree...

If we untangle the A.Div (whatever) from Knighthood, I would still consider Knighthood mandatory to beginning to get a degree... You cant go to college without primary, then middle, then college (local levels apply, lol)....

There are steps...

Our teachings are different, as we are trying to make good humans, not academics, lol...

Then we have yet another split in the house, we would have "Knights, Clergy, and Degrees"

Im not too happy about the clergy spin-off, (as I see it), but, thats for another thread... :pinch:

ren wrote: If we were responsible for purposefully restricting access to knowledge after the full-scale launch of the degree scheme out of political concerns with apprentices (instead of telling them to suck it up and be patient) then we seriously lost our way that day. If we forgot to open the forum to non-knights after changing the requirements to knighthood then what a monumental screw-up.

Not sure if this is what you mean by 'political' but the idea of "hiding" the lessons and points etc was to make sure students, Apprentices and below, didn't spend their time thinking about "points" rather spending their time just doing the lessons.

The Apprenticeship isn't the Degree, but why would we open up the Degree to non-students? As we move to a more modular system I suppose we might try to encourage more stuff like tzb's course , without openly showing everyone all the administrative details we need for the Degree to work but which would only distract people from the actual work itself.

I'll have to agree with ren here, maybe go even further. Learning institutions aren't a novel thing, and frankly there is little need in reinventing them. There is a hierarchy of degrees, academic or not, and aside from the occasional school year, nobody gets to skip anything and get their master's degree before their high school diploma.
However...
Much of the information required for either is available, freely or behind a purchase fee, on the internet and in text books, to every citizen regardless of their academic past or ability to comprehend the material at hand. You do need to have studied engineering before you can get any self-respecting manufacturer to build your rocket plane nor will you be allowed to make a liver transplant if all you are is a dentist, but you do not need to be a botanist to pick weeds from your garden, you don't need to have ever driven a go-cart before you are allowed to take driving lessons, you do not need to learn ancient greek before you can learn modern one, and you do not need to study anything before you can preach a religion.
To cut availability of a lesson to those who have passed a strictly unnecessary rite of passage (I couldn't find a more fitting description) is equivalent to saying that you cannot study astronomy unless you learned to speak latin first... as well as put on this here monastic garment. It's not just absurd, it is also elitist to a non-negligible extent and the mere fact that much of the realm of school and academy functions just fine without restrictions of this sort renders most of any reasoning in its favour moot or at the very least misguided.

Out of your sight, we are further discussing this whole issue...

However, you are correct to say anyone can study, anything...

So, what does access to our list gain someone? Some stuff I might feel is important?

Who cares about what I think?

Study what you like, regardless, your journey is about you...

So lets say you can see the list, and think its crap cause it doesn't have "I love me some Jestor, by Ren", and you deem the whole thing trash, and say, "I'm outta here"...

Or, you clamor for your book to be added, but why should we add it? Because you say so, and you are studying for a degree?

+++++
Quick question, for all, does everyone remember this is a trial program?

MarkAnjuu's announcement states it plainly... l forgot too, lol...

Well I'd think for some of us the post is possibly older than the time we've spent here
I didn't know it was a trial... Where does it say that? Don't trials normally have an end date

I thought a Senior Knight was a Knight who had successfully trained three Apprentices who attained the rank of Knight. Then there was also an additional training option which I don't know the details of. Somebody throw me a bone here.

John....

 
Definition of the rank of "Senior Knight"
A. The rank of "Knight" must be held according to regulations currently in force.
B. The B.Div level of the degree scheme must have been successfully completed.
C. The Knight must have been active in the Order prior to the promotion to Senior Knight.
D. The Council must have approved the promotion to Senior Knight

Edan...

http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/forum/Degree-Qualification-Scheme/31483-details-of-the-degree-qualification-scheme

For those without access....

Edan wrote: Well I'd think for some of us the post is possibly older than the time we've spent here
I didn't know it was a trial... Where does it say that? Don't trials normally have an end date

June 2010... lol...

I would think the title, and "stickyness" would have garnered attention, ...

Akkarin wrote: The Apprenticeship isn't the Degree, but why would we open up the Degree to non-students? As we move to a more modular system I suppose we might try to encourage more stuff like tzb's course , without openly showing everyone all the administrative details we need for the Degree to work but which would only distract people from the actual work itself.

Because it allows people to study without having to become part of the system? People sometimes want to study but do not wish to enter an apprenticeship (in fact under a certain age they're not allowed), or do not wish to be a knight (because of the oath, or do not wish to undertake any of the duties, etc). And if they do change their mind after obtaining the degree, they could always get an apprenticeship then. I'm sue it could only make things more interesting.

Not sure if this is what you mean by 'political' but the idea of "hiding" the lessons and points etc was to make sure students, Apprentices and below, didn't spend their time thinking about "points" rather spending their time just doing the lessons.

Counting to 100 doesn't require that great a deal of time. The fact is apprentices should have been told by their masters they would consider points for the A.Div when and where appropriate, and the apprenticeship would come to an end when appropriate also. Instead, masters asked for "security through obscurity" and got just that, because they can be stubborn with their apprenticeship stuff, we needed their help for the degree and it just wasn't worth the risk. So, down to politics.

Quick question, for all, does everyone remember this is a trial program?

MarkAnjuu's announcement states it plainly... l forgot too, lol...

It stopped being a trial programme (something optional with no other reward than the degree itself for which an average of one knight per year showed interest in) the day we made it a requirement for the knight and senior knight ranks. And I think back then we were slightly short of points for the B.Div in the pool of lessons....

While it is outdated, (actually, I don't think any of us realized our master would track us, and only Br. John is still here of those...

Mine and Damion (Jasper) is gone, RyuJin had Br. John and Kana Seiko Haruki, Alex (Damion, right?)...

Of the three who have earned it as they are supposed too, only Alex's Master is still here...

But, my point was, although outdated, since day one, it has been said to be for Knights...

That was 5 months after I.joined, and 2 months after Ren joined, and neither of us were on Council... lol...

Just fun facts, lol...

Edit: Br. John and Damion are still here, lol...

I wrote that somewhat confusingly... lol...