Jediism and drinking

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15 Apr 2020 13:27 #351150 by

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So whilst I'm still new I thought I'd chip in as I have a bit of experience. I do like a drink, I do love a couple of glasses of whiskey and use to love a smoke with it. I don't do drugs or anything like that. I think Daniel might be speaking from a perspective that says if Jediists don't need other stimulants than the force, it could distract a Jedi from the will of the force if they are reliant on other things. A few people have said that as long as it doesn't consume you and you are reliant on drinking then I'd say it's okay.

I passed my driving test before Christmas and since then I have barely drank anything alcoholic. The lockdown however is a different story but I don't become reliant on the drink, if it becomes a habit then I stop it, it's nice to relax with a drink as long as it doesn't become something I have to do and that would be my take on what Daniel may mean. Some people are straight edge and don't drink at all, don't smoke etc, I am currently 3 months smoke free and that's their choice but I think as long as it doesn't become a problem and distract you from the will of the force then it's okay in moderation.

Thanks

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15 Apr 2020 14:37 #351152 by Alethea Thompson

Replied by Alethea Thompson on topic Jediism and drinking

Jediism Explained: That's mostly because Opie's school of thought has the Jedi Path as more a philosophy than a spiritual endeavor. Whereas the focus of Daniel Jones is to develop a religious school of thought on the Jedi Path.

Concerning Drinking: I actually happen to be of the belief that controlled substances shouldn't be engaged by Jedi for the purpose of spiritual pursuits. I do believe that one should know their limits, and shouldn't drink with the intent to get drunk. But I disagree that it's a "high" you need to seek in your spiritual pursuits.

To me, refraining from these things makes you a better Jedi because you are more aware of the world around you, and can respond to it in kind. If you're seeking a high by connecting to the Force, you're stroking your ego, rather than seeking real spirituality. The Force is a source of information, strength, healing, peace and comfort. In many respects, it should be treated as sacred, not as something to be used for fun.

Now, I'm not saying that Daniel is saying it is. I'm just arguing against the use of the language "high".

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Edan
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15 Apr 2020 17:10 - 15 Apr 2020 17:13 #351156 by Edan

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Jediism isn't really 'anything' because Jediism is at any point a set of rules which we each decide.. we don't have religious texts, messiahs, dogma etc for the most part. TOTJO has its own set of expectations but many an argument here has begun due to the fact that nobody is obliged to agree with them.

Drink, don't drink. The choice has little actual relation to Jediism.

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Last edit: 15 Apr 2020 17:13 by Edan.

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Kohadre
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15 Apr 2020 17:34 #351157 by Kohadre

Replied by Kohadre on topic Jediism and drinking

Edan wrote: Jediism isn't really 'anything' because Jediism is at any point a set of rules which we each decide.. we don't have religious texts, messiahs, dogma etc for the most part. TOTJO has its own set of expectations but many an argument here has begun due to the fact that nobody is obliged to agree with them.

Drink, don't drink. The choice has little actual relation to Jediism.

I can't agree more with this.

Jediism, or at least TOTJO's branding of it is great because it focuses more on spirituality than religious governance. When churches and temples are focused more on governing a general populous (I,e The Vatican, Buddhist Sangha Council, šarīʿah law) you end up with religious wars, inquisitions, oppressive campaigns targeting education, extremism, etc.

It would seem that churches and religious institutions would be more focused on matters solely concerning the spirit, rather than physical / mental / emotional concerns; however is unfortunately largely not the case.

Concerns such as those should be handled by law enforcement, rehabilitative services, community councils, and volunteer workers; rather than institutions focused on matters of faith.

So long and thanks for all the fish

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16 Apr 2020 23:44 #351194 by

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As I respond to all of the posts, because holy crap I didn't expect this to be as decently sized as it is, thank you all for your thoughts and May the Force be with You.

Alethea: I think what he went by high isn't a literal high. I think he meant what Rob was getting at, as in it distracts you from the force. That being said I do think the wording was slightly off.

I think the reason it, not "bothered me" per say, but rather it tinged a little is because of the way it was written. My meaning being that it sounded like he was Stating what one should or shouldn't do, as opposed to simply giving advice on what we should or shouldn't do.

Then again that might just be my interpretation.

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TheDude
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17 Apr 2020 04:30 - 17 Apr 2020 04:38 #351202 by TheDude

Replied by TheDude on topic Jediism and drinking

Well... Obi Wan did order a drink in Attack of the Clones.
The way I see it, it's your body and your mind. Do what you want with them, but try to do so intelligently. If you understand the risks involved with consuming alcohol or anything else and you consent to take that risk, it is your free choice to do so insofar as it does not harm others. No one is going to kick you out of the Temple for having a beer. It may even be beneficial from time to time.
If you find that having a beer makes you and those around you have a better time at a party and doesn't harm anyone, then sure, have a beer. I'll tell you from experience, though, it's really hard to meditate effectively after your fourth or fifth serving!
If you've got a family history of alcoholism, it might not be the best idea. Ultimately it's your body, so invest in it in the ways you see appropriate and try to do so wisely.

EDIT: Also, I'd like to say that mind altering substances have been part of religious and spiritual systems for thousands of years. Whether it is the soma of India or the amanita mushrooms or, even to this day, ayahuasca in the Amazon, these substances have only relatively recently been regarded negatively by religious organizations and, particularly, Western religious organizations. They have served as a tool for personal growth for almost all of our ancestors and I, personally, find the taboo around them to be puzzling to say the least.

Last edit: 17 Apr 2020 04:38 by TheDude.

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17 Apr 2020 06:23 - 17 Apr 2020 06:24 #351203 by

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In regards to Obi's drinking, IKR that was my first thought! Also as someone who has, completely hypothetically of course, "considered" doing LSD one time, it legit helped me get out of a six month depression phase. I still can't explain how but something reset in my brain so I actually enjoyed doing stuff and from then on I wanted to fix myself.

I can't drink beer though. I prefer either mead, to make me all warm inside, or a nice apple bourbon over rocks to ease into the night.

Last edit: 17 Apr 2020 06:24 by .

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Carlos.Martinez3
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17 Apr 2020 17:43 #351213 by Carlos.Martinez3

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Ever know a Jedi to NOT accept a drink or a gift offered... it’s for me the “romance” of Jediism. Captain Kirk in any version of S.T. “always drinks what he is served” but it seems to never phase his decisions or the ability to be captain of a ship.
For me, when that happens - Statements like “as in Rome” can be a excuse for actions or or permission for promiscuous activity, or a way to create a equal mark in life where the worth of things is ”inherit.” My choice.

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Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova

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Carlos.Martinez3
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17 Apr 2020 18:34 #351215 by Carlos.Martinez3

Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic Jediism and drinking

I’ll nurse a beer any day if it means creating a connection standing right next to you.

I’ll bum a cig just to get that time to hear what is inside.

I’ll pour you a dink any day upon request
* I am a Mixologist

I’ll also pay and call ya a cab or take ya home to your wife or hub or family.
I’ve carried wounded soldiers a few miles...
I’ll gladly carry any human who needs a lift.
I drink
I have levels
Jedi have levels or seasons. My hope is they also have a bit of character. Their own - regardless of influence.

Pastor Carlos.

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Build, not tear down.
Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova

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Br. John
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20 Apr 2020 19:20 #351294 by Br. John

Replied by Br. John on topic Jediism and drinking

This is the review on Amazon voted as most helpful.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day though. I say unless you are abusing alcohol or caffeine to a level that's harming you, they are fine to use as you please. That goes for marijuana too. Next we need to discuss LSD, mushrooms, MDMA ,,, they all have a proper use.

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Warning: Spoiler!

Brandon H.
1.0 out of 5 stars Skip it
Reviewed in the United States on April 24, 2018

Verified Purchase

Let me start by saying that I don’t know Daniel M Jones. Other than this book, my exposure to him is limited to one or two interviews he’s given. So, it’s entirely possible that the impression the book gives of Daniel M Jones and the real Daniel M Jones are two very different things.

That said this book was terrible and does very little to convey an accurate picture of the Jedi
Community, it’s history or it’s core beliefs. So, if you’re considering this book because you’re looking for insight into real world Jedi philosophy and teachings, I’d advise you to turn to the internet instead.

The problems seem to arise from the fact that Jones appears to be very ego driven. He read some new age books, and then was inspired by a conversation with a co-worker to start his own church. However, while one would assume that someone starting their own philosophical system would initially focus on discussion and finding a place to work out their new faith, Jones instead decides to put out a press release. He then does an interview and is then upset that the interview did not immediately turn into more attention. This all points to Jones failing to take real time to consider and explore before jumping in and wanting to be the poster boy for real world Jedi (Jones even concedes when he has been confronted by Jedi who have been in the community longer than he has, or who disagree with him that he has the reaction of “do you know who I am? I put Jediism on the map, not you guys”... except the Jedi path isn’t one of seeking fame).

The fact that the early parts of the book are filled with superlatives about Jones, which I can’t help but be shocked that co-author Theresa Cheung didn’t cut or tone down, sets up what seems to be the true nature of Jones very quickly - He appears to want attention. He wants to be recognized. He wants the credit, whether he deserves it or not.

The fact of the matter is the the real world Jedi community is more than 20 years old, significantly predating Jones. Conspicuously Jones does everything he can to skirt that issue (“As far as I was aware when I founded the Church of Jediism there were no other Jedi organizations. I believe I was the first to form an online group of note in 2007”) which seems ridiculous when Google is a thing that exists, and Jones could fact check that real word Jedi had been operating on line for years prior to Church of Jediism.

That notwithstanding, what Jones offers in this book feels like little more than bad science and rehashed tropes from a million bad new age books (he actually touches on Indigo Children and the Law of Attraction stuff presented in The Secret, to give a couple well known examples) which have nothing to do with actual Jedi philosophy. You won’t find anything here that you haven’t seen elsewhere. It’s all fluffy feel good philosophy that isn’t going to do anything to bring you closer to being like the Jedi presented in the films. There’s nothing here to get you past your ego. To really build toward empathy. To work at making you better and more “in tune”. To get you go be more conscientious and service oriented.

It’s just fluffy tropes.

I would seriously advise against this book. It’s not going to lead you down the Jedi path. It’s nothing new. It really feels like it’s just another chance for the author to get some attention. And really, I don’t mean to present this as a gripe session about the author, but it’s frustrating when about half of each chapter is Jones recounting stories from his life about founding his church, or doing press for his church, or how special and unique he was as a child. These stories aren’t on point anecdotes. The book doesn’t need them. And it only feels like they exist to spotlight the author over the material.

I wish Jones the best. And I sincerely hope that the path he’s found helps him, but I can’t recommend this book to someone who is interested in learning more about the Jedi path.

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