addiction

This is a topic that has kind of been spoken about before, but I don't think its had its own 'topic' feed. I was just watching the south park episode 'bloody mary' which basically takes the piss out of alcoholics anonymous. Their point was that it's better to discipline yourself and drink a moderate amount, rather than never drink at all. They also mocked the idea that addiction is entirely out of one's own hands and really said that it is up to the individual to moderate themselves, they should not simply say that they are 'powerless' in the situation.

This got me thinking and I just wondered what everyone thinks on the subject. Even better has anyone on here suffered from addiction? I reckon I agree with South Park. You should learn your limits, learn the effect that things have on you and moderate your intake accordingly. I also find myself really dubious of the idea that addiction is a 'disease' as it is so frequently labelled at the moment. Maybe I'm wrong but I think that there is a difference between being an alcoholic and having cancer; you don't choose to have cancer but you do choose to drink. To use a personal example, I smoked cannabis heavily for two years. About a year ago, however, I realised that it impeded me mentally, my memory got really messed up and I found it difficult to motivate myself and do work. I also found that even cannabis, which is probably the lightest drug (alcohol included) taken commonly, effected my relationships with family and friends. As such I only smoke it on rare, rare occasions. I'm not a saint at all, but in that case I wasn't powerless nor was I diseased, it was my choice to smoke or not to smoke and I chose the latter.

Of course I understand that cannabis is nothing compared to far more addictive drugs and that's why I ask if anyone has suffered from that sort of addiction. I guess the point i'm getting at is, do you feel genuinely powerless? Can you really not stop yourself from taking whatever it is that gives you your kicks? And if you are teetotal is it not better to do the thing you enjoy in moderation rather than not at all. Because if you don't do it all, is it not just the other extreme of doing it constantly? And as such is it not, in both cases, still dominating your life? On the one hand you are constantly trying to do that thing but on the other you are trying desperately not to do that thing.

(Note: I am no expert on this subject but I have come to my own seeming realizations about it)

When I think of addiction, I think of habit. A habit is what occurs when a certain neural pathway in the brain has been made and strengthened over time. Sometimes, when those neural pathways are set and linked to certain substances, it may burn that neural pathway into the brain to a point where hints of it will permanently be there after the habit has been broken - like a scar. In my eyes, this DOES NOT mean that the person is powerless to break the habit and overcome the addiction at all. However, what I think it DOES do, is keep the person feeling Some (if even the slightest) hint of temptation, when exposed to it, due to that neural pathway "scar" that is left. This, as far as I can guess, is mostly responsible for relapses. There seems to be a point in the process of the neural pathway being strengthened that, after you pass that point you become at risk for the scarring. The whole "disease" idea, in my opinion, is mis-termed for this occurrence.

My mother has been an alcoholic just about her entire life (since her teenage years). She is 64 as of this writing. She has also smoked cigarettes just about the same amount of time. Roughly 6 years ago, she was diagnosed with throat cancer, upon finding a tumor on her larynx (voice box). She took one choice out of three - having it removed. She now has an artificial voice. About a year ago, another tumor was found in her lower esophagus about 8 inches long. She began taking chemo-therapy for it.

She beat the cancer. She is, as far as could be seen, cancer free.

She does not drink anymore.
She cannot smoke anymore.
She no longer has cancer.

She beat all three of those.

If she can stop smoking, drinking, AND beat cancer TWICE, then getting over the first two on a normal basis can't be as "futile" as most people convince themselves of it being.

I always thought there was 2 types of addiction, psychological and physiological. The first one is when habits and formed and the person enjoys it so much they have a hard time changing, whereas the second one is when the body develops an actual dependancy which causes physical illness if withdrawn. Some medicines/drugs for example replace naturally produced chemicals within the body and if you wish to stop the medicine you need to gradually reduce the amount to give your body time to restart its own production of the chemicals - otherwise you can crash your own body sometimes leading to death (depending on the particular medicine/drug being used). Some of the more addictive/hard drugs seem to mess with the brain chemistry in a similar type of way.

If its just a psychological dependence then its possible to just man up and knock it off. I think from the harder stuff you've got 2 choices, cold turkey putting up with the pain of withdrawal, or going slower reducing the dose to try and reduce the pain of withdrawal. The latter is more unlikely because with drugs they usually have a psychological aspect as well which is probably alone best handled cold turkey.

Below is my testimony. I've spoken about it briefly before, but I see y'all as my family, and feel ready to further expand. This my run in with addiction. My shameful, highly embarrassing addiction that I overcame:

As a young boy who just hit puberty, I was naturally curious and aroused by the female body. Naturally, I turned to pornography. My brother and I often snuck tapes (wow I feel old saying that, lol) and magazines into the house. Over time, I became more and more hooked on it, unlike my brother. Even when I had gotten a girlfriend, I was still watching it. Being the socially awkward person I was (and still am to an extent) I found that world to be a great getaway. I was constantly learning of newer, free websites that made it easier to get my "fix" and discovered adult chat rooms. I began living a double life. In public, I was the good little Christian boy. Kind to others, always helping. But behind closed doors, when the computer came on, I was a sex crazed pervert.

At first, I did notice women around me. Often staring at their butts and...other areas, and having perverted thoughts. But the cyber world began taking hold. I found myself not being able to go even one day without my daily dose of porn. It soon turned into that being the only thing that turned me on. I no longer stared at women on the streets. In fact, I barely noticed them. The only thing that mattered to me were my "friends" out their on the net, making seductive poses staring at me like they wanted me.

Over time this addiction grew and grew. I went off to college...now I was free of my parents, and could spend my whole day watching porn. Here, in college, I met a girl. She was the one I had first had sex with. I had finally experienced the real thing. But did that stop me? No. I NEEDED my porn. No matter how many times we had sex (which was a LOT) I still felt unfulfilled. I had to get my fix.

Well, we got married...had a kid...and my addiction kept growing. I needed my fix so bad, that I could no longer watch the regular stuff. I found that I had to turn to more adventurous, alternative pornography. Watched videos from all sorts of categories. It was taking up every bit of my life...and I did not know it. Even when it was pointed out, I denied it because I "knew" I had it under control. But I got so hooked, that I began to wonder. The harder stuff was no longer doing it for me. So I turned to talking to men. Talking was where I drew the line, though. Just cybering with them.

I would go to church, direct the coir and lead the praise band, come home, crank up the computer, and off I went into my world. I would even take breaks from typing up the slides for the lyrics of next weeks songs to go into my world. It didn't matter that my daughter was in the room. She was much too young to remember anything, much less understand what daddy was seeing. That's how lost I got. If I went a day without it, I would not be able to sleep. I would lose my apitite.

Finally, my wife had enough. I had said something to an online community about how I couldn't wait for my daughter to turn 18 and...well, i'll leave it at that. I was kicked out. Told I had 2 days to pack my things. I lost my job previous to this because I was falling behind in my work due to my constant need for porn. So there I was, face to face, at last, with my addiction. I finally woke up...too late. My parents almost told me too bad, so sad, and were going to leave me to wonder the streets. Homeless, jobless. But being the strong Christians that they are, they came up, and brought me home with them. My wife told me if I sought counseling, we would work on our marriage.

So I did. I was shut off from the online world. But...I had my blackberry...still had access to what I needed. And I found it. But it was more difficult. I found a group that was better than those *A groups. A strong Christian group, that focused on the scientific aspects of addiction. I learned what caused my addiction. And I also learned that I was NOT powerless over it as those *A groups tell you you are. Finally, I had quit porn. For many nights, I could not sleep. I would randomly break out shaking. I never wanted to eat anything, and I always felt sick.

My personal counselor helped me, though. He taught me what was causing my addiction. He taught me how to learn what my triggers were, to keep me from "falling off the wagon" so to speak. It was perfect. He had obtained his degree from Dr. Patrick Carnes. One of the leaders in the research of porn and sex addiction. I got the full on "this is what is causing it, this is how you can take control of it and fix it" ordeal. Even though my wife did eventually leave me, due to her parents pushing her into believing that I couldn't change, I still kept my strength up. Because I KNEW I had power over my addiction.

The pictures, the videos, the chats, they will always remain in my head. They will always surface from time to time. But I know how to push them back...to fight against them. I have the power. It is my body. Addiction did not defeat me. I defeated it by showing it that I have the power. I had the will to change and I did. I did not quit cold turkey, but over time, I did quit. And you know what? It's been somewhere between a year and a year and half since I saw my last picture and video.

I am now working a full time job, with supervisors begging me to stay with the company so that I can one day run my on store, and i'm starting into a new relationship with a wonderful woman I just met. All because I did not feel powerless. I did not give in. I stood up to my addiction and slapped it in the face with a metal baseball bat.

You are not powerless over your addiction unless you believe you are. It's not until you beat it that you realize just how much power you have. Never let anyone tell you any different.

Mace Feibel wrote:
I also find myself really dubious of the idea that addiction is a 'disease' as it is so frequently labelled at the moment. Maybe I'm wrong but I think that there is a difference between being an alcoholic and having cancer; you don't choose to have cancer but you do choose to drink.

do you feel genuinely powerless? Can you really not stop yourself from taking whatever it is that gives you your kicks?

okay, just to keep myself straight/limit my bloviating, i copypasted some of your questions, to which i will give my own answers with some background.

as some of you already probably know, some years ago i suffered a manic episode due to undiagnosed bipolar disorder. pretty hellish. lasted about a year. during that time, i drank more than i ever had in my life. i have always enjoyed beer, but never to that extent. it seemed i could drink and drink and drink and never feel drunk until my body just passed out like a light. i always had beer at the apartment. i thought nothing of drinking at every opportunity. it wasnt so much an addiction; i never said anything like 'i need beer to live' or anything like that. but yet, there i was always drinking it.

fast forward a few years. i have been properly diagnosed and am stable. i am very active in the local and state level mental health community. work for a local mental health association. gain certification as a 'peer support specialist' through the state to help others with a serious mental illness (SMI). through all this, i learn as much as i can on SMI, and my disorder in particular (of course). i found that there is a very high comorbidity rate between SMI and substance abuse (SA). practically every single 'consumer' (person with an SMI) i have spoken with over the course of these years has an SA issue. just try to take their cigarettes, i dare you! but they also had stories as bad or worse than mine. stories about meth. crack. weed (as you mentioned above). whatever. to a large extent, it is the human brain's hardwired impulse to self medicate. even as i denied there was something wrong with me during the manic phase, my brain knew otherwise, and tried to combat the mania with a depressant. ocassionally it even worked a little. i had moments of lucidity and clarity where, as long as i wasnt talking to you, you would not have known i was suffering from an SMI.

so in this regard, at least, i submit that it is indeed a disease, but one comorbid with a more serious one, brought about by the other. like breaking some bones then becoming addicted to oxy or something, maybe. but yes, i agree that at any time, its still the person picking up the drink. and i never felt powerless. after my manic phase was over, i teetotalled for a while, then started back drinking in moderation, just like south park recommended. why deprive yourself of one of the few joys of life after all? 'beer is proof that god loves us and wants us to be happy,' as ben franklin said.

Wow! Thanks everyone for being so honest, this is why I really love the temple. I would like to try and add something else, but I feel as though everything that needs to be said has already been said.

I fairly recently learned about the way AA handles it. And like South PArk, I disagree. I've been addicted to serious drugs and to cigarettes, and for me, it was all about being in more control. I don't even understand how they manage to stop with that defeatist attitude.

Also, cannabis isn't addictive. Though people might get addicted to the tobacco they mix it with when smoking joints...

My cousin is a police officer and I often remember him saying that so many people say that cannabis isn't and addictive drug , but there are people who start with cannabis,go on to needing a stronger drug. So I have to slightly disagree with you there ren....

you can start by drinking water and move on to alcohol or you could even start drinking alcohol and move on to smoking cannabis or even vice versa. I think the idea of cannabis as a gateway drug is over exaggerated, the first drug I ever took was ketamine and then cannabis. It just depends on what's available and what your friends are doing. There's also that point that drug dealers give things away for free to get you hooked, I've never met a dealer of ANYTHING who gave things away for free, the people who give stuff to you for free are the people that you hang out with.

Well as someone who's done a lot of drinking, tobacco, cannabis and else, I confirm that cannabis is not adddictive and that addiction to one drug does not make someone want to use another. What you talk about has nothing to do with addiction and that phenomenon can be observed with things which aren't drugs.