Jedi and Politics?

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09 Nov 2019 07:12 #345335 by CaesarEJW
Replied by CaesarEJW on topic Jedi and Politics?
I wasn't trying to start a debate people.
By all means, keep doing your thing, but please stay civil.

“Muddy water is best cleared by leaving it alone.” - Alan Watts
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09 Nov 2019 17:10 - 09 Nov 2019 17:12 #345337 by OB1Shinobi
Replied by OB1Shinobi on topic Jedi and Politics?

CaesarEJW wrote: I wasn't trying to start a debate people.
By all means, keep doing your thing, but please stay civil.



Respectfully,
are you uncomfortable with confrontation to the degree that you feel a sense of distress when other people disagree with each other?

You are OP of this thread so you have more say about the direction it can take than the rest of us; if you dont want debate in your threads then you can have the thread locked when it gets beyond your own comfort limits. But people here disagree, debate, and even argue with each other. While you can intervene in your own topics, trying to constantly step in and nanny people during such moments will only add to the drama while depriving the individuals involved the opportunity to work out their differences. Genuine conflict resolution is way more difficult and complicated and frustrating than simply telling people not to argue.

Thank you for reading.

“As long as you feel that you are the most important thing in the world you cannot really appreciate the world around you. You are like a horse with blinders, all you see is yourself apart from everything else.”
-Don Juan Matus
Last edit: 09 Nov 2019 17:12 by OB1Shinobi.
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09 Nov 2019 20:53 #345342 by Rex
Replied by Rex on topic Jedi and Politics?
You did start this by saying "I enjoy healthy political discourse" and I think we've done an excellent job at not resorting to calling each other immature names or comparing everything to Hitler. Everyone here has been participating in good faith, and we've been discussing ideas (about how we approach politics, not even political platforms).

I'm not one of those "conflict is the only way we get things done" sorts of fellows, but I do think that trying to keep your ideas from being tested (especially since they do affect me) is lazy.

To be fair, my comment about Zealot's long-windedness wasn't necessary, so if I offended you Zealot, that's on me and I didn't intend to do so.

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TM: Carlos Martinez
ὁ δὲ ἀμυχηδόν νεξέταστος βίος γίγνομαι βιωτὸς ἀνθρώπῳ
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10 Nov 2019 02:26 #345350 by Malicious
Replied by Malicious on topic Jedi and Politics?
Personally reading the thread so far I think this has been a great discussion and since someone wanted to hear opinions , personally I will share my political views , I think Trump is a great president . Now don't judge me yet I will further explain on this . There are some things I don't agree with that Trump has done . One he reversed Obama era carbon emission and rolled back a few environmental standards as well , but it did create a lot of jobs for Americans that needed it in the fields that the standards was limiting . These are the things I like that he did : he brought back hundreds of thousands of jobs that was sent over seas , made more jobs for the middle class , has done tax cuts that helped middle class and lower class people's , prioritized small businesses over large corporations , the current cease fire that in a way helped people , he is trying to get trade deals with other countries because the US was getting the short end of the stick so to speak . On those topics what I don't like about him is how he is using tariffs to do this by hurting another countries economy but that's basically another country would get the idea of how the US have been feeling by the other countries original tarrifs on us . Now actually appossed to what the main stream media has told you in the FDC that illegals are being held at how they are being ran is the exact same way as the Obama era administration so yes Obama also had kids in FDCs because there parents done something illegal so they were deported or imprisoned and since they have no place to go we keep them there for a short time until they figure out what to do with them . Now hear me out if my parents done something wrong and got arrested we would be but into police custody until A : a family member comes and gets us or B: we go to child services which is exactly what is done with the minors at the FDC . I think of this discussion right here is : A it puts people who are doing something illegal away : B it stops child trafficking : C it stops terrorists that is using our southern boarder to gain entry : D It is a deterrent for people who are trying to gain illegal entry to the US to exploit the government . Which several countries on in middle america you can request asylum or become a citizen , now don't argue with me about the safety of those countries because they are just as dangerous as a large city that has some gang activity which is a decent amount of large cities in the US . They could go to any of those countries but no they come here because most boarder States are sanctuary state which in itself illegal but none the less take advantage of the economy not paying taxes , getting most of the time free health care , and taking high paying jobs from hard working Americans because they work for less . Again don't let what I said make you think badly of me .

=_= Malicious (+_+)
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10 Nov 2019 05:02 #345351 by CaesarEJW
Replied by CaesarEJW on topic Jedi and Politics?

OB1Shinobi wrote: Respectfully,
are you uncomfortable with confrontation to the degree that you feel a sense of distress when other people disagree with each other?

No no, actually I find it quite entertaining.

“Muddy water is best cleared by leaving it alone.” - Alan Watts
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10 Nov 2019 05:05 #345352 by CaesarEJW
Replied by CaesarEJW on topic Jedi and Politics?

Malicious wrote: I think Trump is a great president

You see how when I take this out of context, it seems so much worse? :P
(You actually gave a quite rational explanation, and while I disagree with the opinion that he is a "great" president, at the same time, he's certainly no Hoover, so he isn't a complete failure.)

“Muddy water is best cleared by leaving it alone.” - Alan Watts

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10 Nov 2019 05:09 #345353 by CaesarEJW
Replied by CaesarEJW on topic Jedi and Politics?

Rex wrote: You did start this by saying "I enjoy healthy political discourse" and I think we've done an excellent job at not resorting to calling each other immature names or comparing everything to Hitler. Everyone here has been participating in good faith, and we've been discussing ideas (about how we approach politics, not even political platforms).

Any and all ideology sucks. Always think for yourself.
And, I intended that as a precautionary statement, you guys are doing great.

“Muddy water is best cleared by leaving it alone.” - Alan Watts

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10 Nov 2019 11:28 - 10 Nov 2019 11:44 #345354 by OB1Shinobi
Replied by OB1Shinobi on topic Jedi and Politics?

CaesarEJW wrote: Any and all ideology sucks. Always think for yourself.
And, I intended that as a precautionary statement, you guys are doing great.


Theres a point that youre making here which i completely agree with but im having a hard time articulating it, precisely. Surely, as individual Jedi we have to (or ought to) have a fairly well delineated belief system, does this mean we have an ideology? Is there a difference between an ideology and a belief system?

“As long as you feel that you are the most important thing in the world you cannot really appreciate the world around you. You are like a horse with blinders, all you see is yourself apart from everything else.”
-Don Juan Matus
Last edit: 10 Nov 2019 11:44 by OB1Shinobi.
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10 Nov 2019 13:19 - 10 Nov 2019 14:38 #345355 by Carlos.Martinez3
Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic Jedi and Politics?
This is from personal experience

I find politics strange because we can be smart as a wimp and at the same time cunning and secretive. What we wouldn’t do in real life we do clearly through politics some times. We wouldn’t insult or shoot integrity and inherit worth of each other unless... it politics then it’s fair game. I’m just personally waiting for the “your mama” jokes to come from the stage and I think that will be not even noticed by main steam media when it happens.

Blind hate is blind hate as my son says - no matter what ya call it. Politics isn’t always harmful but a minority of the time it is for me. I can say - 10% of the time I see structure and things accomplished - the other 90 is just a addenda that’s usually not matching with my own. Politics - the ultimate sacrifice to revive some times - some times the obviously one sided and obviously NOT MY cup of tea. I’ve seen it work a few times but most the time real politics keeps others from acting. Just my first hand experience not with just voting and debating but going down to the court house and churches and places that give more than get- on the street and in the corners - politics plays a different role. Most don’t use politics that way but that’s ok too.
I actually use the ideas and practice them rather than argue about them.

Funny thing to me - Jeddist ask what do jedi do - yet they are Jedi and can’t apply what’s needed some times. That’s ok too- A modern day Jeddist does as you do. What does a Jeddist do or act ... what ever and how ever you choose. Don’t let the ability of choice make you NOT make a choice. Experience it. Laws and politics too.
We give food to the hungry. Politics plays a HUGE part in what and how and where in that use. Service and actual giving takes truckloads of politics. Get involved or chat about it - our choose or try out, your choice. Give or hope. Argue or do- That part always bothered me about politics - it’s for every one but I’m already in that 1% that does rather than say. Politics can keep as well as free like any other tool.

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Last edit: 10 Nov 2019 14:38 by Carlos.Martinez3.
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