What do YOU see?

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06 Feb 2019 00:47 #333753 by Kobos
What do YOU see? was created by Kobos
Alright, so I been on a little of posting spree tonight so, um sorry not sorry (see the apology thread for further reference).

So, I want to say I think that with some of the wisdom and experience (good and bad) thrown around recently, we should and might be ready to ask everyone of ourselves; What do you see as far a TOTJO goes? Literally, ask it on so many levels to yourself every aspect you can think of.

Is what you seeing what you want?

Are you seeing what you want (or don't want to) to see or are you seeing what's real?

How do you think we can bridge the two?

I think it starts by asking all of us willing to respond in honesty that question in public. I mean everyone, new and old, guest to Master. Because I think a key comes from the intellectual objectivity that comes from a multitude of perspectives.

Just something, may be it's not time, but think about it.

Much Love, Respect and Peace,
Kobos

I will post my response in a separate post as I still have some thinking to do on these myself,

Your head will collapse. If there's nothing in it. And you'll ask yourself. Where is my mind?
Way out in the water.
See it swimmin.
With your feet in the air and your head on the ground_The Pixies
TM-JLSpinner Training, Brother-Nakis
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06 Feb 2019 05:05 #333767 by Omhu Cuspor
Replied by Omhu Cuspor on topic What do YOU see?

Kobos wrote: ... What do you see as far a TOTJO goes? Literally, ask it on so many levels to yourself every aspect you can think of.

Is what you seeing what you want?


I am responding to this as an occasional veteran of the TOTJO forum, but as a newbie to its more disciplined training program. For the most part, yes, I am seeing here what I want. I see the availability of a relatively structured program offering the opportunity for personal growth and insight, using the Jedi mythos as its ontological foundation. That mythos almost demands that the student approach the training with the intent of expanding in compassion, wisdom, and courage. While I've encountered a number of posts recently from long-term, active members voicing disappointment in what they see as a transformation of TOTJO's primary activities from focused study and contemplation to social bantering, it looks to me like the availability for the former is still here for anyone who wants it. I'm an inner-directed sort of person, and feel capable of taking advantage of the guidance the Temple offers even if others are here just to enjoy some online companionship. (And I perceive there are yet TOTJO members that also find what they can learn here to be of primary importance.)

The one thing I see in these forums that I don't personally favor is a tendency of some to seek out and nurture contention and interpersonal friction. I don't think the Temple sponsors or encourages this, but it does seem to be tolerated more than suits me. I offer this just as my own perception; I'd guess others may endorse the opportunity for interpersonal challenge and sharp (and even harsh) debate. For my part, I'd like to see the principle "attack the issue, not the person" honored more consistently.

I'll be interested to see what those farther along with the training program say.
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06 Feb 2019 07:11 #333773 by Proteus
Replied by Proteus on topic What do YOU see?
I think the temple could just stop being so hard on itself. Instead of putting so much focus on what is wrong, put more focus on what is right and guage off of that (progress). Have you taken a look at some of these journals? Many of them are simply incredible to read. Have you seen what beautiful ideas have been developed in the community being expressed in them? The kinds of lives that are being lived and evolved?

Honestly, you don't have to put so much political pressure on yourselves here. Put more recognition into what has been produced at this place and the changes in lives that have been made - even through all the bumps in the road you've gone through for it.

I'm just saying, don't forget that, and try to acknowledge these things things more. :)

It seems that I know that I know.
What I would like to see is the 'I' that knows me when I know that I know that I know.
- Alan Watts
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06 Feb 2019 09:09 - 06 Feb 2019 09:10 #333778 by Loudzoo
Replied by Loudzoo on topic What do YOU see?
I think we would benefit from following Proteus' thought process, above. Beyond that - a relatively modest change might make quite a difference.

In all religious / spiritual / philosophical schools that I can think of there is always a well defined difference between the Forum (the talking shop), the Offices (for admin and management), and the Temple (the place for contemplation). Whilst we have different sections of the Forum and different rules for different threads (like no posting in others' journals) it is all a bit mashed together. If we could provide some more separation between these three functions than this website currently provides I think that would be really helpful.

Practically that means we might have one 'tab' for the Forum - which would be more open, a little more combative where necessary and which would be open to all registered users. This could even go offsite to Discord - but that might be a step too far. Next there could be an 'Offices' tab for administration - with the same restrictions on access as currently exist. Then there could be a 'tab' for the The Temple itself where the rules and expectations would be different and access / posting ability / rules of engagement would be more tightly constrained. It could include journals, chambers, synod, clergy training and academic discussion.

In this way we wouldn't fundamentally change anything, but the presentation, and experience of being here might be radically different. It would be much easier for people weary of the 'Forum' to walk straight past that to the 'Temple', or to the 'Offices' to undertake administrative activities.
Last edit: 06 Feb 2019 09:10 by Loudzoo.
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06 Feb 2019 12:31 #333781 by Kobos
Replied by Kobos on topic What do YOU see?
So, I thought a lot about this and then I actively sought to not think about it and then I thought about it again.

I would still very much like to see more and wider array of responses, I still think the sharing of these views together is crucial, and perhaps something we haven't done across all spectrum. This is a no judgement thread, for those who tend to stay less active, it is a personal question to each of us and in that there can't be too much judgement.

Loudzoo- I was going to write out almost the exact same thing.

I also, wanted to say I see people and this touches on what Proteus said (which is really kind of the direction I wanted to see this go).

I see people I pass in the hallways, the wise crackers sitting next to me in academic classes, those who "worship" next to me in pursuit of an expanded spiritual experience, and a whole lot of people learning one thing or another; one way or another. These people and myself wouldn't be here if it wasn't for what was built before us. So, yep, sometimes we should back off the political perspective. Look beyond the jungle that is, and see what really is here. It's really quite beautiful.

I would love to see personally, that release of pressure on the self that many place on their shoulders. Civility is huge on me but the irony is not lost on me that it's there I just tend to pay attention to the uncivil (which there really isn't that much of). I think your changes Loudzoo are great ideas, might be a simple step in a good direction. Also, subtle changes can have a huge impact and huge changes sometimes have 0 impact.

I am humbled and made gracious by these replies so far.

Much Love, Respect and Peace,
Kobos

Your head will collapse. If there's nothing in it. And you'll ask yourself. Where is my mind?
Way out in the water.
See it swimmin.
With your feet in the air and your head on the ground_The Pixies
TM-JLSpinner Training, Brother-Nakis
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06 Feb 2019 14:10 #333786 by Manu
Replied by Manu on topic What do YOU see?

Proteus wrote: I think the temple could just stop being so hard on itself. Instead of putting so much focus on what is wrong, put more focus on what is right and guage off of that (progress). Have you taken a look at some of these journals? Many of them are simply incredible to read. Have you seen what beautiful ideas have been developed in the community being expressed in them? The kinds of lives that are being lived and evolved?

Honestly, you don't have to put so much political pressure on yourselves here. Put more recognition into what has been produced at this place and the changes in lives that have been made - even through all the bumps in the road you've gone through for it.

I'm just saying, don't forget that, and try to acknowledge these things things more. :)


Is that one of them Jedi mind tricks I’ve heard about? A wave of the hand and focus gets placed elsewhere. Beautifully done, Pro. :laugh:

It turns out your focus DOES determine your reality.

Still, I would caution against the potential for focusing ONLY on the positive, trying to sweep the negative under the rug. A fuller view of the picture, as I believe Pro suggests, is needed.

“Remember, rewards come in action, not in discussion.” Tony Robbins
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06 Feb 2019 18:19 #333803 by Carlos.Martinez3
Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic What do YOU see?
I find often that the serch for character can lead to a place where i realized -
I am missing a few I kinna want. Stoke that fire a bit. I encourage every one to seek the ones we want out and create those we can not. To be able to create my own volume and depth of faith and where from has led me to be able to adopt a many great ideas. Self responsibility for ones actions plays a direct change in character at times in my life. Huge big ol red marker line curled in my life’s calendars. There are those who can come to point in their faith they become what they practice - the kata begins to become the rejoice rather than the repeat. For me to invoke or begin to try or start somtjimg new - truthfully I begin to read up on it and start asking people I know what up. Half of that is questions here with you fine folk! If it’s somtjimg I want - I begin. In my old age I think I just stoped thinking so hard and just began to be more present than before.
Call it old call it wise call it forgetful call it tired call it call it experience points - what ever you like - I just jump right in... let the music take you in... dance ... try it out - ya never know . That’s how I bridge that gap - I just kinna ... jump it.

Contact The Clergy
Assoc. Pastor of Temple of the Jedi Order
The Block
Build, not tear down.
Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova
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06 Feb 2019 19:43 #333808 by elizabeth
Replied by elizabeth on topic What do YOU see?
I see a place to learn, to grow.
I see a place that cycles through changes, some are hard and people fall away, some changes are easy.
I see life in so many different forms from many different perspectives.
I see an evolving entity that changes with its members and is beautiful, difficult but ever moving forward.
I see the flow of Totjo as it grows.

The mind can calculate, but the spirit yearns, and the heart knows what the heart knows.

TM Karn
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07 Feb 2019 23:15 #333833 by For-Emris
Replied by For-Emris on topic What do YOU see?
I see a place that can become a great international center of Jediism. There are qualified philosophers who are able to develop the ideas of Jedism. They have an apprentices that will continue their business.
But, from my point of view, IP, without which you cannot become a student or enter into the seminary, should be supplemented with several lectures on the history of the Jedi and the history of the Temple.
I was pleasantly surprised by the fact that there are clergy and seminary - this is not and was not in the Jedi communities of the RuNet.
I see a place that can unite Jedi from all over the world ...

Love is a manifestation of the Force that unites all living creatures ...
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08 Feb 2019 16:37 #333851 by Carlos.Martinez3
Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic What do YOU see?
What I see ...
Ive seen ...
what I behold. Lol

I see people come and go. I see people rise and fall. I see people ignite and stag. I see people. Wins losses and try’s. I see people using the temple and I see others hating on it. I see praises and I see dissing. I see love and I see hate.
I am glad we have ALL these things ... and more.
What WE do with it ... ahh that’s the biggie for me. What to do with all this vastness !!il

Contact The Clergy
Assoc. Pastor of Temple of the Jedi Order
The Block
Build, not tear down.
Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova
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