Sithism

Carlos.Martinez3 wrote: Funny but I subscribe to what I call the “ All Myth” which says pretty much all myths for all people. ( Huge label taker off - er for me) Without titles ... would we just be humans making our paths as we go along and adjusting as we live? Would balance be balance if it were found regardless of “where “ or what label we add to it ? If things are a lie and we find them else where ... are they still lies or unattainable if we find them by other means?

I like that perspective, Carlos. I recall the thoughts of an author I encountered long ago, who suggested thinking of ultimate truth as a large, precious jewel in the center of a room. Each of our faith traditions is like a window into the room, and each window allows a view of only a few facetsof the jewel. Due to differences in position, each view is a little different from all of the others. We tend to assess reality with what we see through our chosen window, and while that's helpful we fall short of perfection when we confuse the window with the jewel.

VixensVengeance wrote: As I Sith I do not seek self improvement nor perfection. What I seek is wholeness,... completeness of who I already am. In this pursuit I take in both the lies and the truths and integrate them into one being.

Oneness is a great thing to aim for almost always! Some call it many thing and some don’t call it anything at all. What ever the call - it CAN be a benefit to all who seek it.

Omhu Cuspor wrote:

Carlos.Martinez3 wrote: Funny but I subscribe to what I call the “ All Myth” which says pretty much all myths for all people. ( Huge label taker off - er for me) Without titles ... would we just be humans making our paths as we go along and adjusting as we live? Would balance be balance if it were found regardless of “where “ or what label we add to it ? If things are a lie and we find them else where ... are they still lies or unattainable if we find them by other means?

I like that perspective, Carlos. I recall the thoughts of an author I encountered long ago, who suggested thinking of ultimate truth as a large, precious jewel in the center of a room. Each of our faith traditions is like a window into the room, and each window allows a view of only a few facetsof the jewel. Due to differences in position, each view is a little different from all of the others. We tend to assess reality with what we see through our chosen window, and while that's helpful we fall short of perfection when we confuse the window with the jewel.

Very Indra's net.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indra%27s_net

Thank you for sharing that with me. I Kinna like it ! Perfection is cooking for means even that has a sliding scale that taste great ! Happy seeking

Alethea Thompson wrote: Order of the Sith and Force Academy are the places I'd suggest. ToTJO use to have a Sith affiliate but I have no idea what happened to the archives.

FA? I don’t recommend it for Sith studies. The leader of the forum is closer to dark Jedi and the DA hasn’t been much to speak of for a while now.

Khaos wrote:

LTK wrote: I don't know much about the modern Sith but I'm pretty sure they're not trying to emulate all aspects of the fictional characters that carried the name.

It would be cool to be able to throw lightning.

Not even maliciously, it would just make me feel that much cooler, and I imagine, after the government got done experimenting on me, I would be the life of parties.

I would probably become a DJ with an awesome show.

If they began experimenting on you, it’s highly unlikely they would ever release you. You would go missing, never to be found again. That’s more likely.

Omhu Cuspor wrote: It's interesting to see this old thread become active again. I didn't see it the first time around.

I'm hearing some of the advocates for Sithism here assert that their philosophy/faith does not mirror that of the Sith of the movies ... that instead it is a path toward self-improvement, and the expansion of control over one's life and environment. Fair enough. But if it's unrelated to the movie-version Sith, why call it Sithism? Why not just - well, self improvement?

Real-world Jedi, while we don't wear robes or aspire to levitate things, still use the Jedi characters of fiction as models defining our values and worldview. We believe in the Force, in the merits of service and sacrifice, and that our choices in response to life situations are bounded by an ethical code. The way the movie-based Jedi conduct themselves and look at life serves as a standard we endeavor to use in choosing our own conduct.

Real-world Sith, it seems, don't do that. It appears to me that they, in explaining their belief system, have to take pains to emphasize that they are not like the movie Sith, that they are neither murderous nor cruel nor power-mad. That is good to hear, but to my ears it makes the label of Sith pretty meaningless. Preferring the Jedi path myself, it strikes me as analogous to my saying I am a bologna sandwich but I really am not made up of flour and pork parts, and do not fit in a lunch box; I just like to call myself that.

I've become too facetious and I apologize, but the metaphor still seems to fit as far as I can tell.

Real world Sith philosophy is possible but as I’ve come to conclude, it’s a near perfect match to the fiction. Minus mass murder for seemingly its own sake, it’s very realistic as a path.

And why do you exclude mass murder, tempest?

VixensVengeance wrote: And why do you exclude mass murder, tempest?

Why is this even a question?

Tempest Nox wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote: And why do you exclude mass murder, tempest?

Why is this even a question?

Its a simple question. Why don't you answer it. Why do you consider the realm of mass murder outside the wheel house of a Sith?

VixensVengeance wrote:

Tempest Nox wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote: And why do you exclude mass murder, tempest?

Why is this even a question?

Its a simple question. Why don't you answer it. Why do you consider the realm of mass murder outside the wheel house of a Sith?

The sith weren't alone in their practices of murder and genocide.

Canonically, the Jedi were responsible for the genocidal extermination of the pure blood sith species.

They also were well known for maiming and dismemberment of their foes, even if less lethal means (force push, etc) could have been used instead.

The Jedi were never good;. They were only ever in control, with the backing and immunity of the Republic to pardon their actions.

They were also widely known to abduct or kidnap force sensitive children.

VixensVengeance wrote:

Tempest Nox wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote: And why do you exclude mass murder, tempest?

Why is this even a question?

Its a simple question. Why don't you answer it. Why do you consider the realm of mass murder outside the wheel house of a Sith?

I'll rephrase myself then. For those who aren't sanctioned to kill legally, it's likely impractical.

The sass is palpable....

Tempest Nox wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote:

Tempest Nox wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote: And why do you exclude mass murder, tempest?

Why is this even a question?

Its a simple question. Why don't you answer it. Why do you consider the realm of mass murder outside the wheel house of a Sith?

I'll rephrase myself then. For those who aren't sanctioned to kill legally, it's likely impractical.

Impracticality has nothing to do with it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Starkweather

I find the idea of incarceration to be highly impractical to the realization of passion.

Unless being incarcerated is your passion.

On another level i find that it has no part of me realizing my passion. That is to say, murder, mass or otherwise is not a requirement.

I consider it outside the wheelhouse of a Sith as it ls risk to reward ratio is terrible.

There are much more efficient, safer, and productive ways to go about things.

I also imagine for some there is the other matter of moral and ethical considerations

Its a simple question but its also a dumb one.

I know its more popular to say there are no dumb questions but well, that is not true.

VixensVengeance wrote:

Tempest Nox wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote:

Tempest Nox wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote: And why do you exclude mass murder, tempest?

Why is this even a question?

Its a simple question. Why don't you answer it. Why do you consider the realm of mass murder outside the wheel house of a Sith?

I'll rephrase myself then. For those who aren't sanctioned to kill legally, it's likely impractical.

Impracticality has nothing to do with it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Starkweather

What point are you trying to make here? Do you see some gain in mass murder?

I find your comments highly disappointing Khaos. As a lord you should know better than anyone why I asked the question. I said nothing about incarceration nor did I ever endorse murder as something to strive for as tempest suggests.

I know you have a great interest in Frankenstein’s monster. But why is that? I believe it’s because you can put yourself inside the mind of the monster and view the world from his point of view. He is conflicted in the same way I described conflict in our recent conversation. He wants to be good but he is misunderstood and a source of fear. So he can’t be.

Now take that one step further. As a Sith, I have a fascination with the movie Alien. But when I watch that movie I don’t put myself in the mind of the prey. I put myself in the mind of the predator and I try to view the world from its point of view. It has one passion – Killing. That is what it’s designed for and that is what gives it purpose and it does this without remorse or moral ambiguity. And it will fulfill its need for this passion even if it means its own death. There is a beauty in the purity of this.

Why do you think people are drawn to villains? Why are humans so fascinated with people like Jack the ripper, Jesse James, Billy the Kid, Bonnie and Clyde, Charles Starkweather or a man like Ted Bundy? It’s because they have something desirable. This is a level of freedom that most yearn for deep down inside but will never allow themselves to explore or experience. They are fascinated by this darkness but also repulsed by it. As a Sith I openly explore this darkness because I admit I want to feel that freedom. In that pursuit I dismiss nothing as “outside the wheelhouse” of a sith.

Some of our most popular television of recent decades has focused on the anti-hero and the Villain. Men like Jax Teller of Sons of Anarchy, or Walter White of Breaking Bad. These individuals allow people to safely explore the dark from the comfort of their couch without ever having to take the risks involved. It’s fun but it’s not real. I want to live my life genuinely and really explore how far I'm willing to go for my passion. Even if that means my own death.

What if a law was passed tomorrow that outlawed the pursuit of your passion, Khaos? What would you do? This has happened a lot throughout history. Socrates was put to death in the pursuit of his passion, Galileo was very nearly executed and instead confined for the remainder of his life simply for his pursuit of astronomy. Would you risk death for your passion Khaos? Would you defy that law to feel freedom? To pursue your purpose?

You call my question dumb. Well if this is all you see in my question then I think you have failed yourself as a Sith.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTC_A6Fpccw

VixensVengeance wrote: I want to live my life genuinely and really explore how far I'm willing to go for my passion. Even if that means my own death.

What if a law was passed tomorrow that outlawed the pursuit of your passion, Khaos? What would you do? This has happened a lot throughout history. Socrates was put to death in the pursuit of his passion, Galileo was very nearly executed and instead confined for the remainder of his life simply for his pursuit of astronomy. Would you risk death for your passion Khaos? Would you defy that law to feel freedom? To pursue your purpose?

You call my question dumb. Well if this is all you see in my question then I think you have failed yourself as a Sith.

I really need to ask for some context here, I didn't really catch to much on my reading through the thread. Honestly, I can see how the Sith ideology is applicable to real life, so pursuing your passion ect, really doesn't matter to me, I actually don't actively see as wrong in my Jedi idea because it can grow a person. So that said, I don't really judge to much on the morality of idea. So, this is something that without context I am humbly implored to ask.

Is pursuing your passion in real life against the law as it is written. If the penalty it carries death, then it must be very severe action with intent to hurt others(which I am against but do you). Now correct me if I am wrong (all the Sith) but does the Sith system work because of strict law and harsh enforcement there of. The freedom you seem to be talking about is but a short lived myth. Would it not make sense to play the long game? Where freedom is not just a feeling, you get before death, but one you feel over time in a system you control through discipline to a strict code meant to build your individual power. In real life your ability to control as much as you can within your experience for as long as possible in-order to enact laws and reality in adherence to your own desire.

Chaos, correct me if I am wrong that seems to be the ideology of Sith real life practitioners.

So I, ask for little context from you Vixen. And I will also ask you then not how far you are willing to go, but what freedom you give up for a flash in the pan of "freedom" or what sounds like extreme passion without discipline.

Much Love, Respect, and Peace,
Kobos

Kobos wrote: So I, ask for little context from you Vixen. And I will also ask you then not how far you are willing to go, but what freedom you give up for a flash in the pan of "freedom" or what sounds like extreme passion without discipline.

Much Love, Respect, and Peace,
Kobos

You have meandered here a bit with several sentences that seem to make little sense so I'm not exactly sure what you are asking here, but if I'm following correctly the answer to your question of context is really one of morality and how that defines freedom. The thought was posed that mass murder would not be a Sith condoned undertaking. But that implies a universal moral standard that I do not believe a Sith would ever adopt because it implies an absolute ethical boundary that would ultimately limit the individual. In effect one becomes a slave to that standard. It is a chain, binding the individual sith, that needs to be broken.

*sigh* I'm probably going to regret this, later, BUT, I have my own speculation on the "context" being sought out.
Not the context of your own statements or questions, but of the inciting subject itself: killing.
You're reference to the xenomorphs seems better suited as contrast rather than comparison.
The xenomorphs kill indiscriminately, and opportunistically; it's really all they do, towards a singular goal of spreading as far as possible. It's pure instinct for such creatures, no passion, it's just what they do.
The Sith of Lore were never like this, they were certainly willing to kill in the pursuit of their goals, but only if if they thought it actually would further their goals, and killing in and of itself was never a goal- it's too conspicuous. Sith have a sense of restraint, and were depicted as ultimately pursuing power, and a willingness to kill on it's own doesn't necessarily further such a goal, nevermind serve it.
So, it is my speculation that the context is dependant on the WHY of it.
I don't know enough about real world Sithism, but I imagine many wouldn't endorse killing for similar reasons to a Satanists- they're all about personal freedom and empowerment, and, well, someone can't pursue those things if some jerk decided they'd be more powerful simply for killing them.

Kobos wrote:

VixensVengeance wrote: So I, ask for little context from you Vixen. And I will also ask you then not how far you are willing to go, but what freedom you give up for a flash in the pan of "freedom" or what sounds like extreme passion without discipline.

Much Love, Respect, and Peace,
Kobos

Immediate gratification. Delayed gratification. Gradual gratification. Is one better than the other for all individuals?