Important Biblical Figures!

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06 Sep 2019 13:01 #343379 by Kobos
I recently had a discussion with a good person about a biblical figure, that I would love to learn more about. Though I grew up as an Irish Catholic I never really paid attention. So, in spirit of that I would love to learn more about the biblical figures that people draw inspiration from. I would love to have a great discussion here!

Much Love, Respect and Peace,
Kobos

Fighting what you cannot see, will only lead you to lash out with violence towards everyone. Know your enemy, and you may find yourself a friend.

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06 Sep 2019 16:10 #343389 by ZealotX
Replied by ZealotX on topic Important Biblical Figures!
We kind of started talking about Samson in another thread, talking about hair. The story of Samson starts in Judges 13. The first thing we really learn about Samson is that he was raised from birth to undergo this "Nazerite vow". This is the source of the Rastafarian's dreadlocks.


7 But he said unto me, Behold, thou shalt conceive, and bear a son; and now drink no wine nor strong drink, neither eat any unclean thing: for the child shall be a Nazarite to God from the womb to the day of his death.

This was also the covenant or agreement between Samson and God that allowed him to have the inhuman strength he's known for. He's kind of a juxtaposition to David who defeated Goliath. Samson, instead, was the Goliath. We should also note verse 2 because as it is with other cases where God intervenes, to in essense claim some aspect of human lineage, Samson's mother is barren. This was also true of Abraham's wife, of John the baptist's mother, etc. Extraordinary fruit seem to require extraordinary births in the minds of the Hebrews. I think because of this holy beginning, a kind of holiness (holy=set apart) had to be maintained. The nazarites being a kind of priesthood, fits squarely into this. There is also some parallels with Jesus, his baptism, and being called a "Nazarene". This idea of cleanliness was equivalent to worthiness and determined whether or not God could use or more accurately possess you. This "possession" is never really put into crass terms when it comes to the "holy spirit" but it is treated the same way. There were "clean" spirits as well as "unclean" spirits and all spirits could inhabit and influence people. Hence verse 25...

25 And the Spirit of the Lord began to move him at times in the camp of Dan between Zorah and Eshtaol.

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06 Sep 2019 16:32 #343391 by Carlos.Martinez3
For the record - I’m not a Christian. I am 100 percent Modern day Jeddist - Jedi. It’s a passion and a focus for me. I strive to remind myself daily of these things. In doing that - Jospeh - the story of Joseph comes to mind. There a saying in my circle - the Aladdin effect or for the Christians in the room the Joseph effect. Joseph was a important mans son but he got sold by the upset and fed - upness- of his other brothers, being the favorite kid brother and all. He was taught to read and think and write. During all his trials and imprisonments- his faith - was amplified - by his character. This is how I take the story from there. What was inside each time showed by great character traits... even when he was locked up. The Aladdin effect is when you just kinna got that mind set like - ok well I’m here - let’s do this - I’m a street rat - I’ll improvise. But it’s that “well I figure it out “ that I love. It transcends religion and creates a character well welcomed anywhere.
Character that displays or amplified your faith - what a concept !

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06 Sep 2019 16:48 - 06 Sep 2019 16:50 #343394 by ZealotX
Replied by ZealotX on topic Important Biblical Figures!
Of course the story Samson is most famous for is the one in which his hair is cut and he loses his strength. However, this happens later. It's also very interesting what happens previouosly. Samson seems to have more of a thing to foreign women. In chapter 14 we see him asking to take a Philistine woman. This was not common and so we should take this story as a cautionary tale against Hebrew men marrying foreign women. Women were already seen through a very patriarchal male chauvinist lense where they didn't trust women. This was only magnified when it came to foreign women. So hold that thought.

(again we're now in chapter 14)

So again, verse 6 we have the spirit of YHWH possessing Samson and killing a lion with his bare hands. We should also think of Samson as an allegorical proxy to Israel and how God would help Israel as a nation, WHEN IT WAS PURE/clean. But whenever Israel followed after foreign gods... then the spirit of God would withdraw and they would be left on their own to suffer the consequences. And there were definitely numerous times when they took women as spoils of war and basically followed after the gods of those women. A lot of stories are allegories, serving as judgments against Israel. Now this story is also told in hindsight so the writer knows what's going to happen and tells us that Samson's parents resisted because they didn't know that God wanted Samson to end up where he does and for the story to unfold in the way it does. Samson's attraction to Philistine women is what puts a target on his back that they use greater and greater force to try and destroy him.

So now Samson and this woman are married... well... perhaps not fully. What happens next is basically his marriage feast which is basically the same as a wedding. It's attended by his people as well as philistine men. Different movies, taking artistic liscense, try to fill in the gap of how this came about but Samson ends up offering a riddle which was basically a high stakes bet. Maybe he was showing off. Whatever. But he tells this riddle that would almost certainly only make sense to him beceause of what he observed after killing the lion.

8 And after a time he returned to take her, and he turned aside to see the carcase of the lion: and, behold, there was a swarm of bees and honey in the carcase of the lion.

The philistines were at the deadline, 7 days, and still they didn't have an answer. So they went to his wife and threatened her and her father's house(family).

There appears to be an error here because the deadline was 7 days, they went to her on the 7th day, but verse 15 says she wept before Samson for the 7 days that the feast lasted.

He tells her the riddle and she tells the men and when they finally guess it he knows she could have only been the one to tell them. From there... it gets really violent. Samson goes and basically murders 30 people and took their stuff to exchange for the garments he needed to pay the philistine men he lost the bet to. By the time he gets back his wife was given away to his friend. So in other words, it wasn't consumated prior to the end of the feast. And... someone else "consumated" with her.

I have to show you this. It's extremely irreverent and should not be watched by anyone lacking a funny bone. But it's good and deals with some of the problems in the story.

Last edit: 06 Sep 2019 16:50 by ZealotX.
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06 Sep 2019 17:21 #343395 by Kobos
Replied by Kobos on topic Important Biblical Figures!
I am watching all 3 of these, crude yet funny and informational :)

Fighting what you cannot see, will only lead you to lash out with violence towards everyone. Know your enemy, and you may find yourself a friend.

You can act real rude and totally removed
And I can act like an imbecile- Men without hats

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TB:Nakis

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06 Sep 2019 19:21 #343401 by ZealotX
Replied by ZealotX on topic Important Biblical Figures!
One of the reasons I posted the comical video of the story is because it is sadly quite comical.

(we're now in chapter 15)

Samson was about to go have sex with his new wife but gets cock blocked by her dad. He had made a big scene after she told the philistines his secret so her dad figured he didn't want her anymore. And who can blame a father who sees something like that on his daughter's wedding day. I'm sure she would have seemed a lot safer with someone else; ANYONE...else.

And so in response to this man being worried about his daughter, who in turn only spilled the beans because she was worried about her father and family being murdered if she didn't, what does Samson do? Murder rampage.

First he basically blames all Philistines the same way people blame Mexicans and he rigs some crazy and outlandish Molotov cocktail using 300 fox tails still on the foxes and let them loose in the corn fields of the Philistines. So the Philistines, blaming him, go and kill the woman and her father. And so of course Samson murders them even though he is the singular cause of literally everything so far.

The Philistines come looking for some pay back and Samson rampages again, killing 1,000 men with the jawbone of a donkey. Then he got thirsty and God gave him some water out of a hollow place in the jaw.

(Chapter 16)

Samson sees a prostitute and has sex with her. Believe it or not I'm fairly sure prostitution was not only normal but overlooked by God's law. It was considered a shame for the woman but so much for the man. Perhaps not at all. This isn't the first story involving prostitution but remember Samson is a kind of priest who's not even allowed to consume fermented drinks. Again... male dominated society.

The people of the city (Gaza) at the point are aware of what he had done and were most likely trying to deliver him to the Philistines for judgment. I mean he's basically a mass murderer at this point, killing innocent people just to settle a bet. So they're like let's wait by the gate and kill him in the morning. In the middle of the night Samson runs away with the entire gate. #GazaGate

Once again, Samson sees a pretty foreign face and fell for her. This time it's Delilah. Philistine leaders basically offer her a bounty of eleven hundred pieces of silver... each. She asks. He lies. She asks. He lies. Finally he tells her the truth; that if his hair was cut he would be weak. Of course she tells the Philistine leaders. She gets him to fall asleep on her and she calls a guy to cut his hair. This time when she wakes him up he's weak and so he's captured by the Philistines who put out his eyes.

Beaten, Samson forced to work in the prison but one day there's a party and they bring Samson out to make fun of him. Of course by then his hair had started to grow back. In a final act of revenge Samson begs God to give him his strength one more time so he could avenge his two eyes that they put out. This must have been a huge party because he was able to bring down the house, literally, by pushing against the pillars holding up the roof so that it fell on everyone, and kill more people in this act than he had done during his life.

That is the story of Samson (and somewhere in there he judged Israel for 20 years).
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06 Sep 2019 19:26 #343402 by Kobos
Replied by Kobos on topic Important Biblical Figures!
Well I guess Israel didn't really do much to him..............that is interesting though that God decicded he did a good job of judging Israel enough to give him his strength for the final push. Rastafarians wear their hair then as a connection to Sampson?

Fighting what you cannot see, will only lead you to lash out with violence towards everyone. Know your enemy, and you may find yourself a friend.

You can act real rude and totally removed
And I can act like an imbecile- Men without hats

TM:JLSpinner
TB:Nakis

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06 Sep 2019 19:29 #343403 by ZealotX
Replied by ZealotX on topic Important Biblical Figures!

Kobos wrote: Well I guess Israel didn't really do much to him..............that is interesting though that God decicded he did a good job of judging Israel enough to give him his strength for the final push. Rastafarians wear their hair then as a connection to Sampson?


well, not to Samson but rather the same priestly tradition. The Nazarite tradition was basically the only way you could be a priest outside of the lineage of Levi. This is also said of Jesus since he was of the tribe of Judah.
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07 Sep 2019 02:45 #343413 by Rex
Replied by Rex on topic Important Biblical Figures!
So, I'm curious: who's the figure you were discussing?

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07 Sep 2019 02:54 #343414 by Kobos
Replied by Kobos on topic Important Biblical Figures!
We were discussing the story of Sampson! Hopefully more to come, I would love to learn more of the stories of people from the bible, the stories of the people are quite interesting.

Much Love,
Kobos

Fighting what you cannot see, will only lead you to lash out with violence towards everyone. Know your enemy, and you may find yourself a friend.

You can act real rude and totally removed
And I can act like an imbecile- Men without hats

TM:JLSpinner
TB:Nakis
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