What is the Force

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5 years 3 weeks ago #335045 by Kobos
Replied by Kobos on topic What is the Force
A cooked horse we can all eat, yes?
An experience indeed.......{end yoda voice)

Sorry I couldn't resist............

Much Love,
Kobos

What has to come ? Will my heart grow numb ?
How will I save the world ? By using my mind like a gun
Seems a better weapon, 'cause everybody got heat
I know I carry mine, since the last time I got beat
MF DOOM Books of War

Training Masters: Carlos.Martinez3 and JLSpinner
TB:Nakis
Knight of the Conclave
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5 years 3 weeks ago #335046 by Lykeios Little Raven

Kobos wrote: A cooked horse we can all eat, yes?
An experience indeed.......{end yoda voice)

Sorry I couldn't resist............

Much Love,
Kobos


Hahahahahah. Point well taken.

“Now I do not know whether I was then a man dreaming I was a butterfly, or whether I am now a butterfly, dreaming I am a man.” -Zhuangzi

“Though, as the crusade presses on, I find myself altogether incapable of staying here in saftey while others shed their blood for such a noble and just cause. For surely must the Almighty be with us even in the sundering of our nation. Our fight is for freedom, for liberty, and for all the principles upon which that aforementioned nation was built.” - Patrick “Madman of Galway” O'Dell
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5 years 3 weeks ago - 5 years 3 weeks ago #335048 by
Replied by on topic What is the Force

Lykeios wrote: Why do we keep asking the question?


What is it that is so threatening to you and others about this question that you guys have to make such flipant and capriscious comments?

Honestly, why do you care so much about the content of our conversation that you would interrupt just to disparage the effort?

Is it that you are so scared you might read something that might forever change your preferred view of the subject matter that you must attempt to deflect and distract this thread or otherwise pop poo it to keep those preconceived notions in tact? The only other options I see are are either philosophical laziness or the content being to far advanced so the need to pretend it's a stupid conversation comes out.:evil:
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5 years 3 weeks ago #335049 by Gisteron
Replied by Gisteron on topic What is the Force

Lykeios wrote: Why do we keep asking the question?

That is an excellent question! If the presence and nature of the Force was so clear and evident, why would we keep having to go over it again and again? In our daily lives few things manage to fail giving a consistent witness to everyone quite like this Force that is supposed to be so fundamental and universal. What other all-permeating thing is so subjective? I suspect that the fact that we are coming back to this over and over is itself a (weak?) testimony to how unlikely it is to be of any substance above and beyond the fuzzy feels.

As I'm thinking through more of this post, my thoughts getting ahead of my typing - a feeling I remember you being familiar with also, brother, welcome back, by the way - I'm coming to ponder fundamentals of Jediism. A strong influence for it were various traditions of Buddhism. I dare not say whether they remain these days. The mantra of having to let go, the spirit of detachment is here only emphasizing worldly things, if it is still around, and one is instead to draw a "connection to the Force". Is this not replacing one attachment with another? Worldly pettiness for religious zeal? Who knows...
I think we are doing well stepping aside every now and again to question ourselves, reminding ourselves of what we believe and why, and how those points of view may dilute the clarity of our perspectives, cloud our judgement and trap us in dogma made to compensate for the insecurity we feel upon being born with brains far too sophisticated to walk through the world unthinkingly.


Why not just experience it for yourself?

If you know of a way, I'm all ears...

Better to leave questions unanswered than answers unquestioned
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5 years 3 weeks ago #335050 by Adder
Replied by Adder on topic What is the Force
It's a flux, if you can get a connection. Which is good, because peak experience is a bit overwhelming.

Knight ~ introverted extropian, mechatronic neurothealogizing, technogaian buddhist. Likes integration, visualization, elucidation and transformation.
Jou ~ Deg ~ Vlo ~ Sem ~ Mod ~ Med ~ Dis
TM: Grand Master Mark Anjuu
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5 years 3 weeks ago - 5 years 3 weeks ago #335051 by
Replied by on topic What is the Force

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote:

Lykeios wrote: Why do we keep asking the question?


What is it that is so threatening to you and others about this question that you guys have to make such flipant and capriscious comments?

Honestly, why do you care so much about the content of our conversation that you would interrupt just to disparage the effort?


That is an assumption of the intention, when all it was was a question that could further the conversation. These comments served little more than to jab at the person asking it and to halt conversation on it. You're better than that.
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5 years 3 weeks ago - 5 years 3 weeks ago #335052 by
Replied by on topic What is the Force

Lykeios wrote: Why do we keep asking the question?

We keep beating this dead horse to a second death. Pretty soon we'll have cooked horse (a la the slapping the chicken meme).

Why not just experience it for yourself?


In a community that is growing as quickly as this one, perhaps we keep asking this question to see if someone can bring something new to the table. Perhaps, in a community where we have members who are actively looking for it, perhaps since the last time someone asked it, someone has stumbled across something.

As for experiencing it yourself... well, we always are. ;p However, if anyone makes mention of anything metaphysical, the thread always goes the same way of 'give me proof or you're a liar/fake'.

I've been a fan of the conversation so far, but not personally a fan of how... well, science-y its gotten. Its like light particles/waves. Once you begin to observe it, it changes. Its not in its natural state, as it would be unobserved, as the Force has been until quite recently.

Side note, pass me some horse steak. That stuff's delish. :woohoo:
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5 years 3 weeks ago #335053 by Lykeios Little Raven

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote:

Lykeios wrote: Why do we keep asking the question?


What is it that is so threatening to you and others about this question that you guys have to make such flipant and capriscious comments?

Honestly, why do you care so much about the content of our conversation that you would interrupt just to disparage the effort?

Is it that you are so scared you might read something that might forever change your preferred view of the subject matter that you must attempt to deflect and distract this thread or otherwise pop poo it to keep those preconceived notions in tact? The only other options I see are are either philosophical laziness or the content being to far advanced so the need to pretend it's a stupid conversation comes out.:evil:

I’m not threatened and I’m not calling it a “stupid conversation.”

I’m only asking because I was genuinely curious and because I wanted to get people to think about the reasons they’re questioning the Force in the first place.

We don’t question why air is clear or why the sky is blue every few months.
I am completely open to new perspectives on this, but it just seems like these threads generally bring out the same people with the same beliefs/opinions. That’s all.

The beating a dead horse bit was a joke.

“Now I do not know whether I was then a man dreaming I was a butterfly, or whether I am now a butterfly, dreaming I am a man.” -Zhuangzi

“Though, as the crusade presses on, I find myself altogether incapable of staying here in saftey while others shed their blood for such a noble and just cause. For surely must the Almighty be with us even in the sundering of our nation. Our fight is for freedom, for liberty, and for all the principles upon which that aforementioned nation was built.” - Patrick “Madman of Galway” O'Dell
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5 years 3 weeks ago #335057 by Ambert The Traveller
Maybe it is helpful to look back to how 'The Force' was expressed in the Star Wars myths. It is said there that it has different aspects: The cosmic force, the living force, the light and dark sides of the force.

The Cosmic force, according to our buddhist friends on the path, is emptyness. It can be experienced by shutting up, sitting down for a week, and doing nothing else than focusing on the breath as much as the monkey mind allows. Emptyness is the insubstantial and impersonal nature of beings, an indication of the state of absolute detachment and freedom outside of time and beyond the mind. The beginning of everything. Pure potential.

"The Living Force represented the energies of all lifeforms, and those energies were fed into the Cosmic Force that bound the galaxy together." https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/The_Force

"All that surround us is the foundation of life, [...] the foundation of what connects the Living Force and the Cosmic Force. When a living thing dies, all is renewed. Life passes away from the Living Force into the Cosmic Force and becomes one with it. One powers the other. One is renewed by the other." ( https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/The_Force )

"[...]there is heat in breath and life.
In life, there is the Force.
In the Force, there is life.
And the Force is eternal."

This is from the Sunset Prayer of the Guardians of the Whills. The Guardians of the Whills protected both the ancient Temple of the Kyber and pilgrims who visited it. Remarkably, they were forced to live on the streets when the Empire occupied Jedha in search of kyber crystals and stripped the Temple bare of its many treasures, where they nonetheless remained true to their beliefs by preaching to the citizens about the Force.

The light side of the Force, also known as the Ashla, was an aspect of the Force. The light side was aligned with calmness and was used for knowledge and defense. The Jedi were notable practitioners of the light. The light side of the Force was built around the alignment of tranquility, compassion, selflessness, and unconditional love for all living creatures. In order to achieve harmony and a state of benevolence, its practitioners, namely Jedi, would meditate and let the force flow through them. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Light_side_of_the_Force
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5 years 3 weeks ago - 5 years 3 weeks ago #335063 by
Replied by on topic What is the Force

Lykeios wrote:

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote:

Lykeios wrote: Why do we keep asking the question?


What is it that is so threatening to you and others about this question that you guys have to make such flipant and capriscious comments?

Honestly, why do you care so much about the content of our conversation that you would interrupt just to disparage the effort?

Is it that you are so scared you might read something that might forever change your preferred view of the subject matter that you must attempt to deflect and distract this thread or otherwise pop poo it to keep those preconceived notions in tact? The only other options I see are are either philosophical laziness or the content being to far advanced so the need to pretend it's a stupid conversation comes out.:evil:

I’m not threatened and I’m not calling it a “stupid conversation.”

I’m only asking because I was genuinely curious and because I wanted to get people to think about the reasons they’re questioning the Force in the first place.

We don’t question why air is clear or why the sky is blue every few months.
I am completely open to new perspectives on this, but it just seems like these threads generally bring out the same people with the same beliefs/opinions. That’s all.

The beating a dead horse bit was a joke.



See that's cool. My comments were not designed to be jabs either as ari suggests but a joking intent designed to evoke a strong response like you did here! That's why it had a little devil face lol. Many posts are like that for me and I'm sure if we were in a coffee shop at a table all discussing this and this conversation would have taken place everyone would have gotten that. Different here though so I will explain that.... and I'm totally off topic!!! Ghack!! Hope the subject cops are not about!! (Nuther joke :evil: )

There are new people coming here all the time though and new perspectives get thrown into the mix so its important to keep asking the question. Plus everytime I ask it and i am challenged in conversation like this, it forces me to reexamine my beliefs and further refine them. In particular loudzoo has done an outstanding job of this for me this time around and I appreciate it. He has made me think and that is the point of this discussion, not actually finding the answer to a question we can never really truly answer - who we are - but exploring that question and in doing so actually enact the connection and live that experience of the force in our conversation. Our simple conversation here has allowed me to know loudzoo in a way I never have before... that's really the point of asking the question again, wouldn't you agree??
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