Is the light and dark?

My take:

If you go down a rabbit hole which goes against the very spirit of something outlined in the Jedi Path (typically dictated by an order's doctrine, of which most of us have the same ideas, sometimes different wording, but we all have a base set of similar beliefs), then you are not following the Jedi Path. There is room for you to come back at anytime, but in those moments you are not following the path.

Would I encourage you to seek out things that inherently go against the spirit of the Jedi Path? That depends, is it:

Actively hurting you?
Actively hurting someone else?

If the answer is "no" to both of these, then yes- I would encourage you to go down that route and explore it. If the answer is "yes", then I would not encourage you to head down that route and would (depending on the nature of the subject) encourage you to reach out to a psychologist/psychiatrist to deal with the issue. If you are a danger to yourself or others, then I would seek out a means of getting you into police custody.

Carlos.Martinez3 wrote:

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Coincidently :
In Our own personal search for character , the search transcends light and dark. Take a look here. These list of character traits are neither dark nor light . It's called ... character .

May I point out that these are quality characteristics. It doesn't mention passion aggression, assertiveness, fear, sorrow, frustration...these are what I'd identify as negative or dark side characteristics. I'm not saying that it's wrong to feel these, and passion can really swing both ways. But if you were hiring a person what characteristics would you look for, what about a mate?

When I think of good people, I see people who are not overtly selfish. We all have to have some selfishness to be competitive in the world we live, but not to a point that we have a tendency to only look out for ourselves. When I think of "bad" people I see someone who is only out for themselves. Someone who doesn't care who they hurt on the way to their perceived successfulness.

But that's kinda exactly where I'm going here with this dialog, if we see someone or are someone on that course is it something that needs to be addressed or embraced? I feel like if we were simply more considerate to our near neighbors, eventually you would have everyone willing to help anyone.

So is that a pursuit of light or dark or what?

Manu wrote:

ནའдհдཀ༑ནკ wrote: Simply put, I'd assume that our goal for being in this faith, is to allow us to someday rejoice in our reabsorbing to the life force without fear that death is the end of life. And from that teachings should be guiding us to that goal correct.

Interesting assumption. What made you think this is a goal for most members here?

Honestly I'd go with this being a church thing, as Kyrin stated that they don't believe in an afterlife does that suggest we don't believe we live on through the force after this life?

Does the afterlife have to have a substance or consciousness that resembles this life, or could it be that we return to being energy that continues life as we now know it.

When I think of it in that manner it prompts me to consider reincarnation in a sense. If you think about organ transplants that the life energy of the donner lives in the organ and is transferred to the recipient so that they act or perform in a way that they did not before but do now, and that that was a characteristic of the donner, could that not be similar in case to a new child born through the energy of one who has already passed, gaining their lives insights? Just a tangent thought there.

Back on point though, that the point of most any other world religion, you are taught to be a good person so that you go to heaven and not hell. This being a church I made the assumption that it's a communal belief that we will rejoin the force when we die, but then I guess when you assume, you make an ASS out of U and ME.

So is that a pursuit of light or dark or what?

What you choose to label it is to you

Alethea Thompson wrote: My take:

If you go down a rabbit hole which goes against the very spirit of something outlined in the Jedi Path (typically dictated by an order's doctrine, of which most of us have the same ideas, sometimes different wording, but we all have a base set of similar beliefs), then you are not following the Jedi Path. There is room for you to come back at anytime, but in those moments you are not following the path.

Would I encourage you to seek out things that inherently go against the spirit of the Jedi Path? That depends, is it:

Actively hurting you?
Actively hurting someone else?

If the answer is "no" to both of these, then yes- I would encourage you to go down that route and explore it. If the answer is "yes", then I would not encourage you to head down that route and would (depending on the nature of the subject) encourage you to reach out to a psychologist/psychiatrist to deal with the issue. If you are a danger to yourself or others, then I would seek out a means of getting you into police custody.

So what if the answer was yes?
What if I am straying from the doctrine as you understand it?
What if I act blatantly against the orders doctrine, can you justify interfering or inaction?

Where I work we have a homeless issue. I sympathize with them due to the conditions they must endure, but I have a responsibility to the facility I monitor and cannot accept them loitering in my facility. Some of these people are people who cannot take proper care of themselves. Do I have a responsibility to them that goes against the regulations of my facility management?

I can get self management, ensuring that I act as I perceive a good person should, but won't there always be someone who sees what I'm doing as mean or evil?

I agree that it's narrow minded to only observe the light side of what we view as the Force and versus to shut out all dark sides of the force and you cannot I believe not all of them. Now, of course I do not support "forced" views on society or how one should live and it really depends on your country that you live in what is deemed "lawful" even if it's not and again that is also a subject of debate based on who your talking to or referencing.

I do not again with murder, rape, forms of mental or physical abuse to someone, forcings ones beliefs onto someone else, drunkenness, drugs, child abuse and so on...and these are just some of the things I don't agree with and you can agree with them or not and that is fine. Are these signs of dark sides of the Force? In my opinion yes but, to others no.

Anger, is a hard one and one that as a Jedi I think we should refrain from but, everyone gets angry at some point but, it's also what you do with it. Fictional and non fictional Jedi believe Anger is of The Dark side.

Passion, I think often is one of those grey areas IMO because I am a person that wants to be passionate about what I do in life. Who wants to be too serious all the time?

Just a few that I can think of atm if I come up with more I'll post.

Carlos.Martinez3 wrote: So is that a pursuit of light or dark or what?

What you choose to label it is to you

What I choose to label it is all that matters? So IF I labeled murder, rape, violence, oppression as light, then it's ok for me to act this way?

I know the answer is no as it should be to everyone here, but I also know that this is a ligit claim from some extremist views. The taking of slaves for instance is ok to ISIS as is raping of conquered women. But they see themselves as living as God intended so to them they follow the light, is that accurate to claim?

I'm really just trying to place myself in a situation where I know I need to intervene, but more than that, how to properly intervene to actually help someone understand. I don't know if that makes sense to any of you sorry.

ནའдհдཀ༑ནკ wrote:

Carlos.Martinez3 wrote: So is that a pursuit of light or dark or what?

What you choose to label it is to you

What I choose to label it is all that matters? So IF I labeled murder, rape, violence, oppression as light, then it's ok for me to act this way?

I know the answer is no as it should be to everyone here, but I also know that this is a ligit claim from some extremist views. The taking of slaves for instance is ok to ISIS as is raping of conquered women. But they see themselves as living as God intended so to them they follow the light, is that accurate to claim?

I'm really just trying to place myself in a situation where I know I need to intervene, but more than that, how to properly intervene to actually help someone understand. I don't know if that makes sense to any of you sorry.

label-it as you like and act as you wish.
I Know a many folk and am related to many who see exactly opposite me. That doesn't mean they are invalid. That doesn't mean they are not worth as much as I, as a Jedi - I believe in the inherit worth of all. Practicing it take a bit of work.

Carlos.Martinez3 wrote: label-it as you like and act as you wish.

I honestly don't like this quote. I don't think it's about acting as we are expected to but we have to be held to some standard of action.

If one is absolved of consequence because they take this quote literally and state that it's what YOU told them.

Act as you wish understanding that all action has consequence that you are responsible for, would be a more proper and safer thing to state IMO. We or at least I believe in principles, I hold to those principles in my actions and accept the responsibility for the results of those actions. Because of this I cannot act as I please. If I could a lot of people would get high fives in the face!

Honestly I think I may have confused you in how I addressed this Carlos, however if you truly mean that quote above, what I understand is that you absolve me of anything I do that you perceive as offensive because I was simply acting as I believe for myself. Not sure if that came out right or not so no offense intended.

I just feel that I have an inherent responsibility to act in a manner that is mostly selfless in nature, placing all others before myself first, yet equally in all things. I must not needlessly or senselessly sacrifice myself for another, but must be willing to sacrifice myself for another where appropriate.

What I mean that by jumping in front of a bullet that will penetrate me and still kill who I'm trying to protect is a sensless act of sacrifice when I could inturn bring justice for that person by living instead. Again, I can't act as I want, jump in front of a bullet to save a life, I must act as I should. Not sure if this clarifies or clouds the discussion more.

Just to set the record strait , if you are truly seeking -no word or no statement or question I will ever find offensive. Promise , it's hard to offend some one who is encouraging you and rooting for you on the same team! I encourage real dialogue !


I absolve of nothing. I am not law nor diety and never claim to be. We are held to what standard? And by whom? May I ask.? Laws are laws not standards though They can be some ones standard. My own standards are much higher than that of any law man can create. ( my own opinion in value) I can forgive you on my part and encourage you in my part... that's pretty much it . You will have consequences to actions as far as law and others is conserned. To me ... I am in no compotition with you for anything. Therefore - what and how you choose to practice and choose as far as your actual practice is to you - not by my standards or by my own definitions. They can't. We are two separate people With two distinct paths . Place time and influence play a huge diffrence in the make of our paths.
Let me ask you if you find it offensive why choose it ?
I totally understand where your questions
And your discussion come from.
Trust me .
When a Jedi says they are Jedi there ... to many seem to be no lines no set path and really no explanations of things. This could be further from the truth . We hold a few things as center ... our beliefs our maxims our code but how we each interpret them and practice them is totally up to us. There is no way I can say " well your way's are wrong because it's not like mine" this is what I have penned --- blind hate.
It is even in Jedi ism . If your path isn't similar to mine then it must be wrong.... that path that idea that way of thinking keeps a person from the connection they can possibly share. Their choice and a lot of Jedi make it . With me ... if you say this is my jedi ism ... as I believe in the inherit worth of all - you and your definition and
Practice have become one MORE possibility to me on my own path. This is the hardest thing for Jedi to face. Not like them is ok. I don't have to be like you to be Jedi. You don't have to be like me to be Jedi. You are as valid as I am. We are not the same yet ... we can be. Our center and beliefs may be similar but our practice and interpitarions may not... that's ok!!!!!!! Can u Handel that ? Some can't some won't some ignore it. Blessed are those who keep the connections open and fresh.
Act as you wish . You got sense right ? You got the code right ? You got the center beliefs ... act as you wish , that doesn't mean be a fool or choose anarchy or go crazy or to that similar idea... that actually in this reference means create your own practice- not a license to go nuts and silly. Seek out ... go find.... practice .... do somthimg with it and try it out! Yes to that a million times. !!! Makes more sense ?