IP suggestion: Jordan Peterson

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09 Aug 2019 12:34 #341086 by rugadd
Instead of dismissing anything, try commenting on it at length. Put some thought into it. Really address it. Don't present an excuse to not bother thinking about it all. Why are we here if not to explore our own selves? Many of the fallacies used to dismiss what is being said out of hand deserve dissection, discussion. If it is a Strawman, talk about WHY it doesn't line up, in depth. More than a sentence or two. If it is cherry picking, than you should know WHY its cherry picking. Present the circumstances it is being taken out of context from. If its a false equivalence, put the real differences out there.

Training our brains to dig a little deeper is hard, but we don't rise to our ideals, we fall to our training. If we get in the habit of dismissal, we will be trained to do that and it leads to stagnation. Also, try to remember that ignorance is far more likely the culprit than malice.

rugadd
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09 Aug 2019 12:44 #341087 by Proteus

rugadd wrote: Instead of dismissing anything, try commenting on it at length. Put some thought into it. Really address it. Don't present an excuse to not bother thinking about it all. Why are we here if not to explore our own selves? Many of the fallacies used to dismiss what is being said out of hand deserve dissection, discussion. If it is a Strawman, talk about WHY it doesn't line up, in depth. More than a sentence or two. If it is cherry picking, than you should know WHY its cherry picking. Present the circumstances it is being taken out of context from. If its a false equivalence, put the real differences out there.

Training our brains to dig a little deeper is hard, but we don't rise to our ideals, we fall to our training. If we get in the habit of dismissal, we will be trained to do that and it leads to stagnation. Also, try to remember that ignorance is far more likely the culprit than malice.


To be fair, this took place here. It just wasn't received with any acceptance.

It seems that I know that I know.
What I would like to see is the 'I' that knows me when I know that I know that I know.
- Alan Watts
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09 Aug 2019 12:54 #341091 by rugadd
Yes.

I have found singling people out tends to raise defenses instead of curiosity, though, so I framed it for general consumption.

rugadd
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09 Aug 2019 14:39 - 09 Aug 2019 14:40 #341095 by VixensVengeance aka Kyrin Wyldstar

Kelrax Lorcken wrote: You express yourself well, here, you're feelings are understood, and justified. Yeah, as I already admitted, I insulted you. That certainly falls under "personal attack", and "ad hominem",

Yeah, I am a little paranoid. I have issues tied up in emotions(part of why I stay here; this place has helped me a lot, but we all know by now I've a ways to go), and I misread your understandable anger (I did insult you, afterall) as hostility for being "challenged", which I than read as an attempt to intimidate me; tone doesn't translate so well, here in cyberspace. I got a little scared, there, and tried to "look big".

Call me hypocrite if you like, the word has lost much of it's meaning over the years. It seems like I REALLY upset you, though, more than I would have expected. I imagine we'd agree, at this point, an apology is in order?


Your emotions are not the issue. It is your use of them that is the problem. (or rather their use of you that you allowed by losing control of them) I have not been angry with you nor am I upset with you. As a Sith, I have a thicker skin than that to be sure. I also never called you a hypocrite. Instead you demonstrated yourself to be a hypocrite and I just called you out on it. So that is on you as well.

All you really did by insulting me was invalidate any credibility your previous arguments had. Steamship did the same thing with his temper tantrum. You guys have only succeeded in making yourselves look the fools in this discussion through your actions. You effectively handed all your power over to me and I used it against you. I still have that power since you approached the point of apology and yet failed to actually deliver one. Do you see the difference in the use of emotion here?

Solve' et coagula
Non serviam
Last edit: 09 Aug 2019 14:40 by VixensVengeance aka Kyrin Wyldstar.
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09 Aug 2019 16:00 #341097 by Kelrax Lorcken

VixensVengeance wrote:

Kelrax Lorcken wrote: You express yourself well, here, you're feelings are understood, and justified. Yeah, as I already admitted, I insulted you. That certainly falls under "personal attack", and "ad hominem",

Yeah, I am a little paranoid. I have issues tied up in emotions(part of why I stay here; this place has helped me a lot, but we all know by now I've a ways to go), and I misread your understandable anger (I did insult you, afterall) as hostility for being "challenged", which I than read as an attempt to intimidate me; tone doesn't translate so well, here in cyberspace. I got a little scared, there, and tried to "look big".

Call me hypocrite if you like, the word has lost much of it's meaning over the years. It seems like I REALLY upset you, though, more than I would have expected. I imagine we'd agree, at this point, an apology is in order?


Your emotions are not the issue. It is your use of them that is the problem. (or rather their use of you that you allowed by losing control of them) I have not been angry with you nor am I upset with you. As a Sith, I have a thicker skin than that to be sure. I also never called you a hypocrite. Instead you demonstrated yourself to be a hypocrite and I just called you out on it. So that is on you as well.

All you really did by insulting me was invalidate any credibility your previous arguments had. Steamship did the same thing with his temper tantrum. You guys have only succeeded in making yourselves look the fools in this discussion through your actions. You effectively handed all your power over to me and I used it against you. I still have that power since you approached the point of apology and yet failed to actually deliver one. Do you see the difference in the use of emotion here?


I agree to disagree.

Kelrax "Stormcaller" Lorcken, Jedi Navigator
May The Force Guide You
www.templeofthejediorder.org/forum/47-Jo...-stormcaller?start=0

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09 Aug 2019 18:41 #341106 by VixensVengeance aka Kyrin Wyldstar

Kelrax Lorcken wrote:
I agree to disagree.


Thats fine. However your curt and flippant response really only serves your ego because the problem still exists. As a result you have lost my respect, meaning I will no longer consider your arguments in this or future discussions, you have effectively derailed this thread from something that could have been productive into... well.. this conversation, and you have weakened the stance of those that agree with you by childishly throwing insults in reply to otherwise civil conversation. These are all simply red herrings designed to take the focus of the true issue here. It is a common tactic I see from leftist leaning individuals and these sorts of emotional outbursts are the reason I fight so hard to keep those with this philosophy out of power. You have created the polarization here, not me.

Solve' et coagula
Non serviam
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09 Aug 2019 19:02 #341107 by Phoenix Vidensia
It’s sadly true that the whole “bawling, screaming, leftist throwing a temper tantrum” is a real thing, not just a stereotype.

... Meh ...
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09 Aug 2019 19:14 #341109 by FTPC
Replied by FTPC on topic IP suggestion: Jordan Peterson
who is throwing A
bawling, screaming, leftist throwing a temper tantrum”?

Joined 14 January 2015 16:03 guest - Friday 24, 2015, member Saturday 1/27/2015.Novice -

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09 Aug 2019 19:15 #341110 by Manu
Replied by Manu on topic IP suggestion: Jordan Peterson

Tempest Nox wrote: It’s sadly true that the whole “bawling, screaming, leftist throwing a temper tantrum” is a real thing, not just a stereotype.


But it is a stereotype. Gross over-generalization does nothing but make you look childish at best, and manipulative at worst. Right-leaning individuals can get just as ridiculous as left-leaning ones. I prefer to judge a person on an individual basis, rather than tossing them into some randomly declared group. Radicalism and tribalism is the problem we should be attacking here, not promoting more of with these thoughtless posts.

If your compassion does not include yourself, it is incomplete.

TM: Bruno Moreira (Kyber) | Public Journal
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09 Aug 2019 19:16 #341111 by Phoenix Vidensia

FTPC wrote: who is throwing A
bawling, screaming, leftist throwing a temper tantrum”?


No one is doing that in this thread just yet, it was an example for VV.

... Meh ...

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