January 6 2021 chaos, how to practice the Jedi Way under conflict?

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07 Jan 2021 08:02 #357475 by Kwitshadie
I’m sure you guys have noticed the unfortunate turn of event in Washington DC.
Please be civil but it is there anyway to act as peacekeepers? I see this as an opportunity to make American history in an honorable way.

Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering ~ Yoda
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07 Jan 2021 17:48 #357487 by Zero
This topic need to be softly tread on, and a separation needs to be established between what real Jedi do compared to what fictional Jedi do. We are not police officers in any way and should not be running into crowds holding a lightsaber telling people to stop what they are doing. That is a great way to get your self injured or killed. So if that’s what your referring to Kwitshadie, then I’m going to stop ya right here. If you have something different in mind when you say “act as peacekeepers” then you should probably explain that so that everyone knows what your talking about. But we cannot encourage members to put them selves into harms way due to being confused about what real world Jedi do.

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07 Jan 2021 21:00 #357501 by Manu
The Jedi Way would be to stop fueling extremism (on all political spectrums) and return to a dialogue that treats everyone as human beings. The best way to lead others towards empathy, peace, and understanding, is by ourselves being a beacon for such values.

“The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off.” - Joe Klaas
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07 Jan 2021 21:33 - 07 Jan 2021 22:44 #357505 by OB1Shinobi

Manu wrote: The Jedi Way would be to stop fueling extremism (on all political spectrums) and return to a dialogue that treats everyone as human beings. The best way to lead others towards empathy, peace, and understanding, is by ourselves being a beacon for such values.



While I completely agree with the gist of this post in a general way, having expressed a similar sentiment here: www.templeofthejediorder.org/forum/Philo...jedi?start=10#357478 - tell it to Mitch McConnell. Tell it to the Qanon nut-jobs who stormed the capitol. Tell it to the Russians and the Chinese who take active measures to promote division and incite anarchy in our society. Tell it to the race-nationalists and the anarcho-communists and the unsavory characters who use legitimate social grievances as an opportunity to loot and set buildings on fire. The reality is that we are dealing with a multitude of socio-political forces and factions which are made up at least in part by people who are 100% committed to their own personal victories and the promotion of antagonism and hostility. Of course we should always be willing to offer the olive branches of empathy and two-way, open dialogue with those who recognize the value of such interactions but for those from whom no quarter will be offered, none should be given (I am not encouraging physical violence, here - im simply pointing out that the "nice guy" approach only works with those who are willing to play nice, themselves). There is a very real struggle taking place for which movements and themes will emerge to form the preeminent narrative/s of our generation and if the last four years have revealed anything, it is that the players are a lot more dangerous and the stakes are a lot higher than most of us would have thought possible in 2016.

People are complicated.
Last edit: 07 Jan 2021 22:44 by OB1Shinobi.
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07 Jan 2021 21:54 - 07 Jan 2021 21:54 #357506 by TemplarBrother
Do not tread softly, tread mindfully. Don't try telling people how it should be, teach people how it can be. Let go of "should", "ought", and concentrate on possibility.

Dedicate selflessly, and trust in the Force. We all have our purpose, and all things become clear in time. It's not for us to judge, damn or persecute. It's also not for us to deal in absolutes.

www.pinterest.com/pin/570268371538330165/
Last edit: 07 Jan 2021 21:54 by TemplarBrother.

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07 Jan 2021 22:31 #357507 by Zero
To be clear, I said tread softly in reference to knowing the difference between real life jediism, and the fictional Jedi. You have to bear in mind that we allow children here as young as 13, and I don’t want to see one of them on the news from a hospital bed saying my church told me to act and protect the peace because that’s what Jedi are supposed to do. I see it here all the time, some teen taking something said very literally. I don’t want this to turn into a thread about how to physically intervene in a riot situation. That’s all I meant.

Zero
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” If you can’t explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.” - Albert Einstein
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07 Jan 2021 22:45 - 07 Jan 2021 23:19 #357508 by Kwitshadie
All we can do is set as a shining example to the public.
The question is how to go about it, and you have made a wise and on point response. Kudos Zero. :) It’s unfortunately a folly that Biden and Trump had made; calling the roiters to stop the violence. Trump Ultimately conceded defeat this morning after his call for pacifism failed.

Unfortunately I’m not being given an option to edit the first post. You may edit as you so wish however I appreciate that there are no Sith-like responses; like charging out of vengeance for example. :) My sincere kudos also.
It’s not the Jedi way to charge out of vengeance and when they pull out the lightsaber, even in the trilogy it’s usually out of self-defense. I’m afraid we have crossed the rhubacon already.
Politically I’m on the Milktoast fence-sitter and have been raised that way. But I admit it’s scary to be neutral during these times.

Quite frankly I’m afraid that unless if you are living in the woods; like Master Yoda in the original trilogy, with things going the way they are I dread that there will likely be no escape from the violence. Lot’s of families are having hard conversations currently.
I’m afraid we Americans have crossed the Rhubacon, the Left and Right’s world is just too different. All we can do is set an example.

As a side note. It’s really weird when your Birthday marks a day in American history.

Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering ~ Yoda
Last edit: 07 Jan 2021 23:19 by Kwitshadie. Reason: Adding on to avoid getting timed out. :)
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07 Jan 2021 23:26 - 08 Jan 2021 00:33 #357510 by OB1Shinobi
An Ode to the Sitters of Fences:

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist

Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist

Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist

Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew

Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

-Credited to Martin Niemöller 1892–1984

People are complicated.
Last edit: 08 Jan 2021 00:33 by OB1Shinobi. Reason: Because I'm not a communist.
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08 Jan 2021 03:38 #357521 by Manu

OB1Shinobi wrote: Of course we should always be willing to offer the olive branches of empathy and two-way, open dialogue with those who recognize the value of such interactions but for those from whom no quarter will be offered, none should be given (I am not encouraging physical violence, here - im simply pointing out that the "nice guy" approach only works with those who are willing to play nice, themselves).


I appreciate the input, and agree with you. I am in no way advocating doing nothing out of some sentiment for a moral high ground. Nor am I naive enough to expect everyone to play by the book.

What I intended to point out, is the whole "to someone with a hammer, everything looks like a nail". You (the proverbial "you", not you Obi1) set out in some crusade to defeat oppression, and suddenly everyone looks like an oppressor to you. Gross generalizations, the media telling the story, and social media filtering what you only want to be showed, feed the mob mentality that cements tribalism, and suddenly everyone in a given group ("the left", "the right", "the patriarchy", "the rich") is deemed an enemy.

We should be vehement about our individual activism, but be on guard about this "dark side" that is quick to join us in battle.

“The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off.” - Joe Klaas
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08 Jan 2021 14:43 #357527 by Alethea Thompson
I agree with Manu. Just know you're going to catch flack for standing against both extremes. I've been catching it for a long time, and yet somehow this time around many people have straight up forgotten that I take a hardline against violent outbursts from either group.

Despite it being an opinion of many people, it's not at all popular to stand in the center and tell everyone off. Even in the Jedi Community it's not popular because we have so many people that think the fiction is calling us to arms as part of the Rebel Forces against the oppressors.

It's not. There are a number of key differences between how the Empire & First Order acted and how our real life government acts today.

The Empire committed Genocide (best word I've got for it, the Jedi weren't really a race of people or from a particular country, but even after they were wiped out the Empire sought to kill off Force-Sensitives, or recruit them to the cause...soooo Genocide). They also worked on better methods to coerce people.

While America has done really awful things, our collective governments are trying to sort through and listen to reason. It takes time and effort though. Because getting the model right requires a lot of moving parts- financial, theory vs. practice, figuring out what is wanted by the people, what is humane, what the risks are, etc. Sure we have some very hardline people that won't budge, fortunately that's what voting is for- but people need to actively get interested in determining leaders from the highest office to the lowest office they can vote for. People who have a vision need to get the courage and encouragement to run for an office, so that communities aren't trying to pick between a couple of people with big egos, but public servants. The system, on paper, isn't what's broken- it's the people running the system that are breaking the people.

We Jedi can do a myriad of things.

Zero, you said we aren't police officers. Not as a whole, but there are individual Jedi which ARE police officers. Jedi can become police officers and work towards a LEO method of restoring order. But as a group, no- it's not the role of the Jedi Community to be Police Officers.

But in this, I can point out that we individually all have our strengths. We've been talking about what the Community as a whole can do- we can do a lot if we promote that everyone's hero's journey is personal and there is a role you can play in the healing of your respective nations. It may be a small role, but a summer's rain is made up of a lot of drops of water falling from the sky and making an impact upon the earth by joining together.

As a group, the one thing we can all do is curb our language on social media. Instead of yelling at one side or the other, treat them equally. Erase harmful words in your vocabulary that only incite more emotions amongst your detractors. Recognize that such language pushes people further to the other side, and you're simply creating more enemies than friends to whatever cause you believe in (as long as the cause isn't against the Jedi Path). Don't share the funny memes which serve to embolden extremists. Watch some videos on Mind Hacking to get an idea of what the social media environment is doing to us and the friends around us so you can work on countering it (PBS has a fantastic series called "Hacking Your Mind", I think you can find it on Amazon too).

But as individuals, we can do a lot more with our sphere of influence. It may take time and patience to get the skills for it, in order to ensure we're not taking dangerous shortcuts. But hey! We're Jedi! Patience is kinda our thing ;).

/rant/unpopular opinion :D
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