Apology

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31 Aug 2016 16:43 - 31 Aug 2016 16:44 #255067 by Zenchi
Replied by Zenchi on topic Apology
OB1Shinobi wrote...

fair warning; i offend some people pretty regularly, and you might not be making any friends to appear to be "on my side" lol


I'm suddenly having the most terrible sense of deja vu...

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Passion, yet Serenity
Knighted Apprentice Arisaig
TM- RyuJin
Last edit: 31 Aug 2016 16:44 by Zenchi.
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02 Sep 2016 00:33 #255379 by OB1Shinobi
Replied by OB1Shinobi on topic Apology
well maybe i can return the favor here lol

Senan wrote:

JamesSand wrote: As for Sne1a - No one wants to offend you on a personal level as far as I can understand - You can have whatever name, gender identity, or anything else you want - but to demand everyone else be aware of and make amendments to their behaviour to suit is as oppressive as them dictating your behaviour and preferences to you.


All this can be summed up in one of my Father's essential life lessons "Drive like everyone on the road is trying to kill you"


I certainly do not intend to create any animosity with this, but I think it is fair to point out that we are not "on the road". We are in a Temple. Being so, there is an expectation of certain behavior. One such expectation of a Jedi is to treat others with here, whether we agree with them or not.

Is there a need to have a tough skin sometimes? Yes.

9. Jedi have integrity. We are authentic to what we believe and are open, honest and true to our purpose and our minds. We remove all masks to reveal ourselves as courageous and noble of heart. We do not hide from fear of damage to our image because we know that our image cannot be blemished from the words and actions of others.


However...

13. Jedi cultivate empathy. We try to view things from another’s perspective making us sensitive listeners. We provide the confidence people need when talking through their difficulties and we share our learning with those who would benefit. We do this to help create a more harmonious society.


Addressing someone by the pronoun they have respectfully requested we use for them should not be seen as a demand, but rather an opportunity to treat someone with the respect we all should hope to receive while we are here. This is a Temple, after all.


and yet again i agree with everything youve said, but when i read JamesSand's post i had the impression he was saying its not reasonable to expect everyone to just know your gender - if you want to be recognized as a female then its your responsibility to present yourself as a female, and if you have a male face as your avatar pic, be ready for people to refer to you as a male, at least until youve had the conversation

thats how i took it anyway

People are complicated.
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02 Sep 2016 04:23 #255397 by JamesSand
Replied by JamesSand on topic Apology

fair warning; i offend some people pretty regularly, and you might not be making any friends to appear to be "on my side" lol


I'm not here to take sides, I am here to learn, and if possible teach as well.

If there are those here who will be unhappy with me because I do or don't disagree with other members strictly on principle, I doubt I'll lose sleep over it - However they are more than welcome to raise their grievances with me.
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02 Sep 2016 11:17 #255415 by Jestor
Replied by Jestor on topic Apology

Silas Mercury wrote: Ha, yeah, OB1, Jestor groups you, me, Gisteron, Ryder and Khaos as 'Rebels' lol !!


Careful, thats not what I said... ;)

Sorry for the derail... ;)

Please start a new thread or PM me if this gets too off track, lol... :lol:


Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]

On walk-about...

Sith ain't Evil...
Jedi ain't Saints....


"Bake or bake not. There is no fry" - Sean Ching


Rite: PureLand
Former Memeber of the TOTJO Council
Master: Jasper_Ward
Current Apprentices: Viskhard, DanWerts, Llama Su, Trisskar
Former Apprentices: Knight Learn_To_Know, Knight Edan, Knight Brenna, Knight Madhatter
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02 Sep 2016 11:49 - 02 Sep 2016 11:50 #255418 by Zenchi
Replied by Zenchi on topic Apology

Jestor wrote:

Silas Mercury wrote: Ha, yeah, OB1, Jestor groups you, me, Gisteron, Ryder and Khaos as 'Rebels' lol !!


Careful, thats not what I said... ;)

Sorry for the derail... ;)

Please start a new thread or PM me if this gets too off track, lol... :lol:


Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]



You "lumpin" me in with Hannigan now?? Think you hurt my feels... :(

My Word is my Honor, and my Honor is my Life ~ Sturm Brightblade
Passion, yet Serenity
Knighted Apprentice Arisaig
TM- RyuJin
Last edit: 02 Sep 2016 11:50 by Zenchi.
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02 Sep 2016 11:51 #255419 by Jestor
Replied by Jestor on topic Apology

Zenchi wrote: You "lumpin" me in with Hannigan now?? Think you hurt my feels... :(


lol, yes, but in my 'favorite people' lumping... ;)

On walk-about...

Sith ain't Evil...
Jedi ain't Saints....


"Bake or bake not. There is no fry" - Sean Ching


Rite: PureLand
Former Memeber of the TOTJO Council
Master: Jasper_Ward
Current Apprentices: Viskhard, DanWerts, Llama Su, Trisskar
Former Apprentices: Knight Learn_To_Know, Knight Edan, Knight Brenna, Knight Madhatter

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02 Sep 2016 15:52 #255484 by steamboat28
Replied by steamboat28 on topic Apology

Senan wrote:

JamesSand wrote: As for Sne1a - No one wants to offend you on a personal level as far as I can understand - You can have whatever name, gender identity, or anything else you want - but to demand everyone else be aware of and make amendments to their behaviour to suit is as oppressive as them dictating your behaviour and preferences to you.


All this can be summed up in one of my Father's essential life lessons "Drive like everyone on the road is trying to kill you"


I certainly do not intend to create any animosity with this, but I think it is fair to point out that we are not "on the road". We are in a Temple. Being so, there is an expectation of certain behavior. One such expectation of a Jedi is to treat others with here, whether we agree with them or not.


When that request is reasonably produced, yes. However, in instances where that request seems more like vocal outrage that someone didn't do a 15-page background check on the individual in question first before daring to address them with pronouns at all, it gets to be a bit more than off-putting.

I don't know of anybody that profile creeps everyone that talks to them, and until we know for a fact what pronoun someone prefers (usually by them, y'know, explicitly telling us), it's impossible to guarantee you've gotten it right. Jedi we may be, but not one of us is a mind-reader.
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02 Sep 2016 17:15 #255512 by Senan
Replied by Senan on topic Apology
Agreed, Steamboat. I don't think anybody was intentionally trying to be rude to Sne1a, so there should be no reason to get defensive or be offended. Likewise, the request to be referred to using a certain pronoun should be just that, a request. Demanding it without first making the request is unreasonable. Regardless, she took offense.

I guess I was just trying to point out that if we unintentionally upset someone, I hope we can make the corrections that we can and move forward without having to place blame or justify why the error happened in the first place. Although, I guess we need to know why it happened in order to prevent it happening again.

I pretty much just convinced myself that I have no idea what I'm really trying to get across here :P

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02 Sep 2016 17:18 #255513 by Silas Mercury
Replied by Silas Mercury on topic Apology

Senan wrote:
I pretty much just convinced myself that I have no idea what I'm really trying to get across here :P


I know the feeling :laugh:

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02 Sep 2016 18:05 #255529 by rugadd
Replied by rugadd on topic Apology
We do sort of over think things here alot.

rugadd
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