Temple Crisis Hotline

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13 Dec 2014 03:45 #173693 by Jestor
Replied by Jestor on topic Temple Crisis Hotline

Or offer advice....


I mean responsible advice...

My favorite maxim is "knowing when not to act"...

Or in this case, "don't over reach"....

On walk-about...

Sith ain't Evil...
Jedi ain't Saints....


"Bake or bake not. There is no fry" - Sean Ching


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13 Dec 2014 03:48 #173694 by Silvermane
Replied by Silvermane on topic Temple Crisis Hotline

steamboat28 wrote: I don't say this to suggest that anyone here is qualified (at all). In fact, I think it's a very helpful, honest, and important step to admit that we are almost certainly completely unqualified. Without admitting that, we presume that we can handle what's thrown at us. Rather, I say this to suggest that there are many problems that we, collectively, are qualified to help with--at least in the initial, emergent stages. Solace from trusted friends and fellow pathwalkers can be just what is needed to help until more professional aid can be summoned.


Very well put, Steamboat. I agree. I think we can listen and help out with things that do not require legal counsel or serious professional aid. And this is basically what I was trying to say. We can fix or help with everything, but we can help with quite a bit.

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13 Dec 2014 03:52 #173695 by Silvermane
Replied by Silvermane on topic Temple Crisis Hotline

Jestor wrote:

Or offer advice....


I mean responsible advice...

My favorite maxim is "knowing when not to act"...

Or in this case, "don't over reach"....


This is where I believe people need to know their limits. If you've never experienced an issue or had experience with something that someone is asking you about, how can you offer advice? That is like asking someone how to cook a Turkey when they've only ever cooked raman noodles. They would have no clue. You should only seek advice from someone that has experience with what you are wanting to know.

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13 Dec 2014 04:06 - 13 Dec 2014 04:07 #173696 by Jamie Stick
Replied by Jamie Stick on topic Temple Crisis Hotline

Rickie The Grey wrote: I think it's a bit much to think this place can handle a crises hot line. Look at how some discussion go. No insult or offence intended. People lives could be at stake. Ignorance is not bliss. On the other hand I also think clergy would feel the desire to help those in need.

Helping people is good. People need to know their limits.

This probably doesn't help much but if in doubt error on the cautious. Ask yourself if you had a good friend of family member in crises where would you send them. Here?


Honestly, I think it is dangerous and irresponsible to have a crisis hotline. People coming to us in a crisis would need immediate attention and who among us has the time to drop everything for every crisis that comes in? I'm not saying it's impossible, but there's so much we haven't accounted for.

What I would like to say is that I think having a place where anyone, at any time can send a message anonymously and give voice to secret shames, private fears, and problems they can't talk to usual suspects about is a great idea. We would probably have to have a disclaimer that says, "By submitting a message, you acknowledge that you understand this is not a medical, psychological/psychiatric, or other professional therapy service. The readers of submissions are clergy who work on a volunteer basis."
Last edit: 13 Dec 2014 04:07 by Jamie Stick.

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13 Dec 2014 04:19 #173697 by Br. John
Replied by Br. John on topic Temple Crisis Hotline
We can offer spiritual counseling and peer group therapy. For situations where someone is in an immediate crisis they need to contact a properly staffed and trained hotline. Members interested in helping with urgent can't wait situations should train and volunteer at these organizations. A link to an emergency directory on the front page is a good idea.

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13 Dec 2014 04:23 #173699 by Jestor
Replied by Jestor on topic Temple Crisis Hotline
Of course....:)

Although we are calling it a "hotline", we are talking about using email, how "hot" can it be?

Perhaps a name change is in order.... lol...

On walk-about...

Sith ain't Evil...
Jedi ain't Saints....


"Bake or bake not. There is no fry" - Sean Ching


Rite: PureLand
Former Memeber of the TOTJO Council
Master: Jasper_Ward
Current Apprentices: Viskhard, DanWerts, Llama Su, Trisskar
Former Apprentices: Knight Learn_To_Know, Knight Edan, Knight Brenna, Knight Madhatter
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13 Dec 2014 08:12 - 13 Dec 2014 08:13 #173709 by Alexandre Orion
Yes, Jestor -- a name change is definitely in order. To me, "hotline" doesn't mean a medical (mental health or otherwise) or technical problem. To me, I see two red phones - one in Moscow and the other in Washington D.C. - and a whole lot of nuclear weapons pointed at each ...

I remember the hotline when it came about and didn't really think much of it at all ... but then I don't lump everything people can feel into some "being sick" category either. A few months ago, this came up again over the Confession, Clerical Counselling ; all of the arguments are the same : who's qualified ? We have only to present found "help" to be a neutral enough term that we don't get accused of promoting suicide through 'un-qualified bogus psychic surgeries' or hocus-pocus.

People aren't comfortable talking to Clergy. Are they really that comfortable talking to a psychologist/psychiatrist/life coach ? It seems to me that if someone has something on their mind that they need to talk about "right now", it is because that person is already uncomfortable. It isn't a matter of who they talk to, they just need someone's attention. They don't need someone to give them the solution to their problems, they need someone to say "I understand" (whether one does or not).

Has anyone ever had a grand-mother ? Or a best friend ? These people we feel pretty comfortable talking to ; we can tell them about anything. And we (might) listen when they respond to whatever they respond. Often grand-mothers respond with warm biscuits and a warmer smile and best friends respond in best friend ways, but the point here is that neither my grand-mother nor my best friend are "qualified" to listen to my problems. They are just people that I can bitch at when I need to do. Nor is their feedback going to fix the problems. They are just "there", they are sounding boards, they are avenues of expression where I'm not afraid of being judged or under the pressure of having to make sense.

Our "talks" are quite a bit like that. In the TotJO Clergy, we study how to listen to people in an understanding way, of perhaps not responding at all except by "I understand".

So, no -- we are not going to all go get trained as clinical psychologists and we are not going to go offering magical solutions to all of the woes of the human condition. But we can listen to people who are emotional and do not make sense without requiring them to and without judging (or telling them that they make no sense).

I am not going to publicise my credentials to listen to someone any more for someone coming to me to get things off their chest in the Temple any more than I already do for people I know (this happens frequently) or strangers at busstops and in caf├ęs. My biggest "credential" is just that I'm there and have ears.

Be a philosopher ; but, amidst all your philosophy, be still a man.
~ David Hume

Chaque homme a des devoirs envers l'homme en tant qu'homme.
~ Henri Bergson
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13 Dec 2014 09:11 #173712 by Brenna
Replied by Brenna on topic Temple Crisis Hotline

Alexandre Orion wrote:
People aren't comfortable talking to Clergy. Are they really that comfortable talking to a psychologist/psychiatrist/life coach ?




Just to be pedantic, that would better read as "psychologist/psychiatrist/counseling therapist. While most life coaches are trained in one or more of the other fields, life coaching is NOT crisis or trauma resolution.

But since you ask, people certainly seem comfortable.



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13 Dec 2014 11:02 #173717 by Amaya
Replied by Amaya on topic Temple Crisis Hotline
I don't like this idea as I understand it, while people here can help others just by listening a lot of the time in my experience because they are helping based on their own experiences they are starting of with preconceived ideas of what the other person feels or needs to hear. They already have an idea of what works.
People don't actively listen and it causes more problems. Your not counsellors or trained and in a hotline situation more damage than good could be done.
Good intentions are all very well but I think having maybe a list of useful helpline numbers such as in the UK the Samaritans , rape crisis, and others maybe displayed somewhere on site would be better.
A counsellor is trained to see what is happening not from there own experiences (though they are helpful) but from a nuetural standpoint. And trained to offer advice, even in passing the person on to other professionals. They have a team to back them up and resources at their disposal. None of which we have here.

On the issue of people being uncomfortable talking to the clergy, I'm sorry but I think you do that to yourselves. There is training on how to be available and how to talk to people in a manner that helps create a safe comfortable environment. Which again we don't have.
Help as a friend is always a good thing, but as is not butting in when people don't ask for your help.
It's a fine line and sometimes how you initially ask if someone needs help could be improved.

Everything is belief
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13 Dec 2014 11:14 - 13 Dec 2014 11:23 #173718 by Alexandre Orion
Well, perhaps ...

We're not saying don't ring up or talk to anyone else. If we are really all that wretched, then just don't come talk to us. Talk to whoever you want to. Or don't ...

But please stop telling me that I'm not qualified to listen to other people. That is what I've been doing for much of my life already. And it really doesn't matter what you think of my qualifications ; I already have a good reputation for listening well and responding with at least enough to know that I've actually listened to what thy were saying (as opposed, say, to thinking about my shopping list during it all ...)

It all boils down to who wants to talk to whom about what. If you (no one in particular here -- you generally) do not feel us qualified to listen to you, then don't come to us with things. But please don't tell us that we can't listen to others. That would be pretty pretentious ...

The solution to that is pretty simple ...

Be a philosopher ; but, amidst all your philosophy, be still a man.
~ David Hume

Chaque homme a des devoirs envers l'homme en tant qu'homme.
~ Henri Bergson
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