Attention council members (suggestions from those you lead)

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17 May 2021 00:01 #360197 by Zero
About a week ago I was approached by a couple of our lower ranking members about if there was a way to contact council with suggestions, complaints, or comments and they key was they wanted to do it anonymously. They had fears of retribution’s and promotions being held back if they brought there issues forward. In light of there request I created a post and offered to post this thread anomously, soo here goes. Most of these were repeated by several different members.

1. Several members would like a thread here created by a council member that updates the temple as to what things are being voted on, when they will be voted on, and if the vote passed or not. This would provide transparency that the membership request without allowing them access to council discussions. In therory, this would be a locked thread so that no one could comment on it.

2. Multiple members have made note of certain rules not being followed in regards to advancement. An example being that the rules say you advance after items a,b, and c are complete, but when those things are checked off, the temple has been disregarding those rules as written and holding people from promotion based on a single councilors opinion.

3. Several people want to inquire as to why there are councilors and people holding other temple offices, who have not been at the temple in months and in some cases over a year. It blocks others (and there are several) from becoming more involved with the temple. And on the same note, there are wonderful knights and councilors here who hold multiple positions (as many as 4) who do a fantastic job, but on the same hand, they also block others from becoming more involved with the temple.

4. Almost everyone has mentioned either knight Edan or Master Rosalyn as being very deserving of some form of official recognition for all of their amazing work they do. I personally am of the opinion that with out these two wonderful women, our temple would have been in shambles months ago if not for their continued capacity to go above and beyond.

5. There are system issues that have been present for working on almost a year now such as member photo albums still do not show up for most of our users.

6. There have also been several request for updates from the knights corps as to when the new ip might be ready, as well as when the Jedi service corps will become a thing. I personally explained to these members that there is no way at this point that we could provide an exact date for either, but mabye we could create a thread to post regular updates as they happen.

The purpose of this thread is not for council members to feel attacked or threatened, but my way of communicating the request of those below the rank of knight (which is 99 percent of the temple). The flip side of that coin is that this isn’t a to do list for the council. Temple leadership will make all decisions as to what, if any, of these issues they will address, and how they will do so.

Zero
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17 May 2021 00:22 #360198 by ren

2. Multiple members have made note of certain rules not being followed in regards to advancement. An example being that the rules say you advance after items a,b, and c are complete, but when those things are checked off, the temple has been disregarding those rules as written and holding people from promotion based on a single councilors opinion.


Could you clarify what rank progression we are talking about and how exactly did it fail?

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17 May 2021 00:57 #360200 by RyuJin

Zero wrote: About a week ago I was approached by a couple of our lower ranking members about if there was a way to contact council with suggestions, complaints, or comments and they key was they wanted to do it anonymously. They had fears of retribution’s and promotions being held back if they brought there issues forward. In light of there request I created a post and offered to post this thread anomously, soo here goes. Most of these were repeated by several different members.

1. Several members would like a thread here created by a council member that updates the temple as to what things are being voted on, when they will be voted on, and if the vote passed or not. This would provide transparency that the membership request without allowing them access to council discussions. In therory, this would be a locked thread so that no one could comment on it.

We used to do this, it caused as many issues if not more as it supposedly abated...people got mad that they couldn't voice their thoughts on things, and when we allowed them to voice their thoughts it turned into a total fiasco

2. Multiple members have made note of certain rules not being followed in regards to advancement. An example being that the rules say you advance after items a,b, and c are complete, but when those things are checked off, the temple has been disregarding those rules as written and holding people from promotion based on a single councilors opinion.


Typically if a promotion has been withheld it is because even though certain things have been done, the individual in question may be lacking in something... sometimes that is often one of the most crucial things to a Jedi....patience

3. Several people want to inquire as to why there are councilors and people holding other temple offices, who have not been at the temple in months and in some cases over a year. It blocks others (and there are several) from becoming more involved with the temple. And on the same note, there are wonderful knights and councilors here who hold multiple positions (as many as 4) who do a fantastic job, but on the same hand, they also block others from becoming more involved with the temple.


Simple answer, we have given many members opportunities to be involved...none of them are here any longer...those of us on the council and holding offices are the few that have managed to stay around...we may or may not be as active in the forums as those with less responsibility, but we are always watching things...I have been here 12 years myself...only 2 other active members have been here longer (maybe 3)...everything being brought up now, has been brought up before and tried before and failed before.

4. Almost everyone has mentioned either knight Edan or Master Rosalyn as being very deserving of some form of official recognition for all of their amazing work they do. I personally am of the opinion that with out these two wonderful women, our temple would have been in shambles months ago if not for their continued capacity to go above and beyond.

Ah, yes both of these wonderful Ladies have in fact had official recognition and have discarded it for their own reasons, they are not as caught up in titles or rank as some are

5. There are system issues that have been present for working on almost a year now such as member photo albums still do not show up for most of our users.


There has always been an issue of some sort that is constantly being worked on behind the scenes, we update the site and redo it constantly, but we can't always fix everything

6. There have also been several request for updates from the knights corps as to when the new ip might be ready, as well as when the Jedi service corps will become a thing. I personally explained to these members that there is no way at this point that we could provide an exact date for either, but mabye we could create a thread to post regular updates as they happen.

We have been trying to find out about this as well...

The purpose of this thread is not for council members to feel attacked or threatened, but my way of communicating the request of those below the rank of knight (which is 99 percent of the temple). The flip side of that coin is that this isn’t a to do list for the council. Temple leadership will make all decisions as to what, if any, of these issues they will address, and how they will do so.


Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]


Out of darkness, he brings light. Out of hatred, love. Out of dishonor, honor-james allen-
He who has conquered doubt and fear has conquered failure-james allen-
The sword is the key to heaven and hell-Mahomet-
The best won victory is that obtained without shedding blood-Count Katsu-
All men's souls are immortal, only the souls of the righteous are immortal and divine -Socrates-
I'm the best at what I do, what I do ain't pretty-wolverine

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Former Masters: GM Kana Seiko Haruki , Br.John
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17 May 2021 01:33 - 17 May 2021 01:35 #360201 by Zeth Windwrecker


Simple answer, we have given many members opportunities to be involved...none of them are here any longer...those of us on the council and holding offices are the few that have managed to stay around...we may or may not be as active in the forums as those with less responsibility, but we are always watching things...I have been here 12 years myself...only 2 other active members have been here longer (maybe 3)...everything being brought up now, has been brought up before and tried before and failed before.


Hello RyuJin. My name is Zeth, and I do not believe I've had the pleasure of speaking with you yet.

I am interested in one day pursuing an office here at the temple, but hearing you say that things have been brought to before and failed sounds like you are not open to new idea from new temple members, and I sincerely hope that is not true. Could you please clarify if there will be chances for members like myself to run for offices in the future?

Please and thank you.

Zeth Windwrecker

Teaching Master: Raxicorico

“No, failure is not the end. It is a necessary part of the path” - Master Eno Cordova

“Remember, persistence reveals the path” - Master Jaro Tapal

“Our mistakes are in the past... It's about what we do next that’s important” - Cal Kestis, Jedi Knight

Last edit: 17 May 2021 01:35 by Zeth Windwrecker.
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17 May 2021 01:47 #360202 by RyuJin
We always hear things out, evaluate, and more often than not we allow things to move forward even when we have already seen the scenario play out the same repeatedly...then we bear the blame when things don't work out...we always hope that one of them pans out...

Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]


Out of darkness, he brings light. Out of hatred, love. Out of dishonor, honor-james allen-
He who has conquered doubt and fear has conquered failure-james allen-
The sword is the key to heaven and hell-Mahomet-
The best won victory is that obtained without shedding blood-Count Katsu-
All men's souls are immortal, only the souls of the righteous are immortal and divine -Socrates-
I'm the best at what I do, what I do ain't pretty-wolverine

J.L.Lawson,Sr Knight, B.div, Eastern Studies S.I.G. Advisor (Formerly Known as the Buddhist Rite)
Former Masters: GM Kana Seiko Haruki , Br.John
Current Apprentices: Baru
Former Apprentices:Adhara(knight), Zenchi (knight)
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17 May 2021 01:48 #360203 by Zero
Zeth makes a good point. While I haven’t been here for 12 years, I have been here almost every day sence January 2018, and anytime I ask about getting more involved with the temple, I get the run around. You said you gave others opportunities and they are no longer here, that dosnt address the issue. I’m here, other knights are here regularly, plenty of apprentices are here regularly.......just because others left dosnt mean I will, and I’d hate to think that my abilities as a knight and a leader are being disregarded because of the actions of other knights that left.

If the photo albums can’t ever be fixed then why not remove them completely. People put up new photos all the time and they vanish the next day.

If promotions can be withheld for any reason, then why have a list of rules saying if you do this you get promoted? Why not add to the rules and say outright that any councilor can withhold your promotion for any reason?

Zero
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17 May 2021 01:51 - 17 May 2021 01:52 #360204 by Zeth Windwrecker

We always hear things out, evaluate, and more often than not we allow things to move forward even when we have already seen the scenario play out the same repeatedly...then we bear the blame when things don't work out...we always hope that one of them pans out...


does this mean I can assume I will be allowed to be nominated for offices in the future, and potentially hold that office?

Zeth Windwrecker

Teaching Master: Raxicorico

“No, failure is not the end. It is a necessary part of the path” - Master Eno Cordova

“Remember, persistence reveals the path” - Master Jaro Tapal

“Our mistakes are in the past... It's about what we do next that’s important” - Cal Kestis, Jedi Knight

Last edit: 17 May 2021 01:52 by Zeth Windwrecker.
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17 May 2021 01:58 - 17 May 2021 02:12 #360205 by dwagoonie
I only have a moment presently, but I would like to weigh in on what I find bothersome. If you look at a normal every day organization, you have a person in charge of the different functions. You do not see 1 person holding several functions. That is too much for any one person. Especially when they have a life outside of the organization to handle as well. If a position has been unmanned for a certain amount of time, it should be refilled by someone who is interested in it and not pushed onto someone who already has their hands full. There is no glory in accumulated positions until there's nothing left for anyone else.


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Last edit: 17 May 2021 02:12 by dwagoonie.
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17 May 2021 02:04 #360206 by River
It can be so frustrating to see what feels like the same ideas, the same tries, the same projects, start and be abandoned again and again. Especially of you feel like you're in a group getting blamed for them not working out. I definitely understand that. That's a definition of insanity after all, right? To do the same thing and expect different results?

The thing is... even if everything about a project plan looks exactly the same on paper, it's entirely different because there are different people involved. There are a lot of reasons a project may not be wise to try, but I hope that ideas won't be rejected solely because "we already tried that."

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17 May 2021 10:47 #360209 by ren
I don't see how ryujin's answer can be understood to mean there are no opportunities for 'employment'. Everyone who has an office now used to not have one.

Ideas are always given time to be correctly implemented, have different people give it a shot. Some have been failing for years now. It's also good to know when to quit.

Convictions are more dangerous foes of truth than lies.
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